The infamous Airship fight.

Kintrra · Post by **Kintrra** » Sun Oct 07, 2007 11:47 pm

Aight, I've made one attempt at this fight so far (more like a half-ass attempt, but it was only cuz a friend of mine said he could "guarantee" a win on it...it didn't work <.<; lol), and now that I've seen up to Omega, I'd like to get everyone else's opinions on it who've been through it.

What strategies you've tried, what worked, what didn't. Just if a feel like it, pwease? ^^;

Post by **Fiye** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:17 am

Excuse my language.

And look below for a MUCH better explanation to the fight.

Post by **Shirai** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 4:26 am

First of all:
This mission cannot be halfassed!!
Even with the tone down on it you will still need to give it your best.

Omega is definitely the longest fight of the mission.
Paladin tank on Omega isn't your best bet but it can be done with a pally.
Have your softer characters stay out of AoE range, at all times.
Having them hit with AoE's means extra healing for the whm, which means more hate.
Hate is very tricky as Omega has a hate reset move (Pile Pitch.) and easily goes after the mages if used back to back on the main and back up tank.
(White mage is required for this fight!, no other job has access to erase at that level and no other job can stona, these spells are both needed!)

Melee should indeed go /nin as most of the aoe's can be/are absorbed by shadows.

Bring meds, Ethers, Potions, echo drops, reraise, antidotes, Elixers, bring the whole medicine cabinet you've been using throughout CoP will be used again here!
Bringing an extra Hi-potion/ether tank isn't a bad idea.
If one has space have a mage bazaar potions for 1 gil to grab as soon as your stock runs out.

Omega has HP, metric tons of it!
Chip it down slowly by melee damage and SCs (If you have a BLM make him MB it with light nukes until hate really is settled.)
(Nothing like a trigger happy BLM sending a guided misile toward the mages, which usually means one shot!)
Also keep the DoT's up. (Bio, Poison, burn, shock, choke or drown, rasp and frost.)
When it reaches 30% start applying CCB polymer pumps to slow his TP spamage as he starts zerking by then.
Also at 30% start zerking yourself to kill him asap, you'll want to save CCBs for Ultima.

The fight has enough time to wipe once!
If you wipe right at the beginning of Omega get your tail out of that BC and rethink your strategy.
If you wipe with Omega having just a sliver of health left reraise and have a blm or someone with a damaging 2 hour finish him quick!
If you wipe with omega lower then 50%, reraise, recover and continue where you left off.
Also when you wipe neither Omega or Ultima will recover HP when left unclaimed but make it a priority to recover asap!

One last thing:
Positioning!
As said before keep mages out of AoE range and pull omega to a spot
where you can reraise safely in case of a wipe.
Also try to wipe in a spot where Omega doesn't agro when you reraise.

The same goes for Ultima.

@Fiye:
It's all right, just watch the language a bit.
This board doesn't have many rules, but we like to keep the bad words to a minimum.

Okuza · Post by **Okuza** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 1:07 am

It's pretty much like most PMs. If you take it seriously, it's easy. If you take it easy, you die.

Make sure you don't have your tanks as the ones to use the CCBs. They won't be able to do anything (no JAs or spells) for about 5s after using one.

Make sure you DO use them at the right time. Omega and Ultima start out seeming like they're pushovers. At about 20% they go wild. If you don't use the CCB just before the wild stage, they'll end up wiping your group.

NIN tanking is amazingly good for these fights. NINs start out slow on hate and build up more and more over time. If the NIN has merits and great enmity gear, it's highly likely that even PLD invincible won't pull it off at the end.

You'll want TWO tanks. The hate reset moves makes it easy to wipe if there isn't a second tank with nearly as much hate as the first after a Pile Pitch. I did second tank once as NIN and ended up main tank about 50% of the way through -- PLD couldn't pull it back off me.

Coach your DD jobs on doing very little damage at the start on U/O and then finishing very strong. Slow steady damage is the key to letting the tank build up hate. If you have a PLD, you'll probably have serious MP issues both for the PLD and for the healer, but PLD works fine if you plan ahead for it.

Tianshii · Post by **Tianshii** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 12:37 am

When I've done this and won, we've had a NIN tank.
As y'all before me mentioned, it isn't that PLD can't do it but I've always had a NIN on hand for the battle.

The NIN aggro'd the mammets and took them to the far left corner.
Melee picked off one at a time and killed them.
WHM focuses only on the tank.
The other mage(s) cure melee.
Another way is for everyone to solo a mammet, sometimes this is great, sometimes not so much. If everyone can solo well, then you'll save some time.

For Ultima & Omega NIN pulled to the Right of the door.
Mages go to the Left of the door.
(doesn't really matteer, as long as you are @ the side w/ the door in case of a wipe)
Omega has a nasty ability..I forget the name but it shoots something out its rear so... try to avoid standing directly behind it.
Mages should try to keep blink/stoneskin up.
In past runs, everyone had CCB. I usually had mages put it up for 1gil b/c of that ability delay & no desire to go near Omega or Ultima

. Before the fight we set up a CCB order and had 1 person calling out when to use it.
Melee using CCB would restock between Omega & Ultima (if you use all CCB on Omega you're prolly sh*t outta luck

)

As others have said before me... you MUST take the fight seriously and bring meds! Even with the "nerf" this fight is in no way easy.
Also, stay calm. Focus on your task and don't freak out if one of your party members gets killed.
Even as a mage, I bring a reraise item, it saves me MP for that emergency cure to save the tank or something.
This fight is NOT the time to be frugal.
Besides, anything you don't use save for next BC.

Post by **Fiye** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 5:08 am

There wasn't a nerf to the Airship. The nerf was aimed at the Promyvion mobs, Snoll BC, and Tenzen BC.

Eviticus · Post by **Eviticus** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:34 am

Fiye wrote:There wasn't a nerf to the Airship. The nerf was aimed at the Promyvion mobs, Snoll BC, and Tenzen BC.

This is why I'm downright proud of the fact as a Pup/War I solo tanked Shikaree Z with no mage support or blackened siredon. 7 WS's to the face with 3 SC's. That was a wild ride.

Post by **Sugami** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:10 am

Thought I'd raise this dead thread considering my group just attempted it twice yesterday.

Party: PLD DRK THF SAM RDM(me) WHM

Short of it is PLD couldn't handle the Enstun from Omega and we couldn't do enough damage to him before we ran out of MP

Next we'll probably try swapping me for NIN and the PLD for BRD, our THF is leaving us soon

we'll have to replace him with something with good DoT no doubt.

Post by **Shirai** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:32 pm

Sugami wrote:Thought I'd raise this dead thread considering my group just attempted it twice yesterday.

Party: PLD DRK THF SAM RDM(me) WHM

Short of it is PLD couldn't handle the Enstun from Omega and we couldn't do enough damage to him before we ran out of MP

Next we'll probably try swapping me for NIN and the PLD for BRD, our THF is leaving us soon we'll have to replace him with something with good DoT no doubt.

A suggestion from my part again.
Don't swap the PLD with nin unless he has nin leveled.
Otherwise when you can add a ninja to the fight and he can join have him come as pld/nin in DD gear if possible.
The DoT build occasional flashing and back-up cures will build a good amount of hate.
Make him stay a whee bit under the main tank's hate so that a Sentinel can pull Omega off the main in case of an emergency.
Having 2 tanks for this fight is definately no overkill measure.

If you can go nin by all means go for it!
Replace the thf with a support job, preferably one that can help cure.
(A second whm, a BRD to some extent, a smn or a rdm.)

Post by **Sugami** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:24 pm

Problem is the THF has nothing else leveled that high and I could use all the help possible in tanking so that evasion song will go a long way

Post by **Shirai** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 6:05 pm

Try with what you have then.

It can be done with one tank but the whm needs to give his/her A-game to keep you alive even with bard buffs.
Next to that you might want to wear some enmity gear.

ScarlettPheonix · Post by **ScarlettPheonix** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 9:12 pm

Definitely need the WHM to be on his toes- Omega and Ultima are just plain nasty mean. I hated Chemical Bomb soo much ><

One of my favorites guides for CoP is Erecia's- I didn't start using it until I already had Sea- but she gives some really good advice for strats and etc in it for all the missions- I think her write up for 6-4 is with a PLD as tank too if you want to take a look.

Post by **Fiye** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 5:28 am

Oh yes, lemme add one thing.

As has been said before, do /NOT/ get behind Omega.

Have all Melees stand to one side of Omega, the Tank at the front, and the mages quite a distance away from Omega, but generally inside the right angle the Tank to Omega to Melee formation creates.

If Omega uses his petrification attack even once, consider it an unlocked move, and chances are, he'll be more than happy to spam it.

And from experience, curing petrification isn't fun. 1.) Wastes additional MP, and 2.) Melee's/Tank can't do jack s*** until you waste that bit of MP on Stona.

Post by **Sugami** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:42 pm

I don't have enmity gear, my NIN was a cheap gimpo when I leveled it

My main worries are hate and if he manages to get Enstun to hit me, that could screw me over completely

Post by **Shirai** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 1:24 pm

Sugami wrote:My main worries are hate and if he manages to get Enstun to hit me, that could screw me over completely

My main advise to the whm regarding that.

Flash, learn to love it!

Kintrra · Post by **Kintrra** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 8:12 pm

Shirai wrote:
Sugami wrote:My main worries are hate and if he manages to get Enstun to hit me, that could screw me over completely
My main advise to the whm regarding that.

Flash, learn to love it!

Main problem I can see with that Shirai, is 3/4 of the WHMs I've leveled with 1) Don't seem to have any idea when to use Flash, and 2) Have no clue how to stay far enough below the hate line that they don't yank hate with it.

Post by **Sugami** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 10:38 pm

Update~ party: NIN(me) DRK/NIN SAM/NIN THF/RNG WHM BRD

1st attempt: Lost on Omega again, he got a lucky stun proc followed by a special to finish me off

2nd attempt: Got Omega down to 1%, raised and finished him off. Died on Ultima, Slow couldn't be removed or Hasted over and I ended up with no shadows and 30 seconds on both timers

THF was subbing RNG to spam all kinds of bolts as his Daggers didn't seem to do much previously. Seemed to work well for Omega as Acid would proc but less well for Ultima. He's buggering off to Canada (what's that all aboot, ey?) so we're one man down now

ScarlettPheonix · Post by **ScarlettPheonix** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:48 pm

/comfort

The thing with the Slow move is that it puts a slow/elegy combo on you that must be erased x2 to be removed. Haste/March won't overwrite either and are overwritten themselves if they're on you. I remember my static's WHM cursing the Erase recast timer frequently during our (many) airship fights.

Post by **Sugami** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 6:35 pm

So casting Erase twice will remove it? Hmm...

Post by **Fiye** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 6:47 pm

Sugami wrote:So casting Erase twice will remove it? Hmm...

Yeah. It does come off as Elegy and Slow. When I did the fight, I just focused on casting Erase, while the RDM would Haste.

The big problem with Ultima is... well... i don't really know. My group got rid of him a few seconds before the time went out. And really... its about as blank to me as the Diabolos fight.

Really, you got the fight down know. Omega is a big pain in the rear end, and if you can kill him. Ultima should be a minor problem.

Just, attempt to stay alive until ultima hits 50%. If you can manage that in the airship fight, you should be good (Counting if you killed Omega without wiping two times or more).

Also, try to attempt to save your 2HRs. It can help.

Also, a THF using SA on Ultima to grab hate and then using perfect dodge would be a great opportunity for some quick rest.

Okuza · Post by **Okuza** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 8:25 pm

IMHO, you're *far* better off without the THF/rng than you are with him. A THF that thinks acid bolts are the key to victory is just wasting his gil and your party slot.

There is one critical component missing from your party line-up: a co-tank. Co-tank is absolutely essential. You can maybe squeak by with luck using a single tank and go maybe 1/10 on success rate. With two tanks, you will win 9/10 airship fights. Slow isn't the huge terror really. It's the pile-driver move that resets hate on the tank. If you don't have another tank ready to take over INSTANTLY (ie. hate is already capped and swapping between both tanks), it's going to start shredding your party into confetti.

A minor change you might make is to have your bard sing either 2xMarch or 2xMambo for you depending on your gear and experience. HNM experienced nins would probably prefer march, since that's what they do most often at 75. If you're not geared for march, you could try mambo and gearing enmity/evasion.

Without a co-tank, you're going to have a really really rough time, though. Another nin/war or nin/drk would be ideal, but even PLD or WAR or DRK can work if they're geared for it.

Post by **Shirai** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 10:28 pm

Okuza wrote: Without a co-tank, you're going to have a really really rough time, though. Another nin/war or nin/drk would be ideal, but even PLD or WAR or DRK can work if they're geared for it.

That was my initial advise as well, having the PLD go PLD/NIN.
These days they can build great amounts of hate, take over from you in a pinch and be a good back up cure for your party.

A bard will help a lot too but it's not as "essential" as having someone to back up for you.

Kintrra · Post by **Kintrra** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:47 am

My only problem Shirai, with PLD/NIN, is it's a 60capped fight. At that level, we get Flash, Ichi, and jack-crap of much else. At least as /WAR I can throw Defender back up. I just have a VERY severe distrust of PLD/NIN before 74.

Okuza · Post by **Okuza** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:24 am

Kintrra has it down for PLD/nin. I had originally typed PLD/nin then the other half of my brain (the half that sits back and enjoys the show) started laughing at me, which I found very embarrassing. So, I removed that part about PLD/nin.

60-cap kills off sub/nin pretty much. PLD/war works OK, just make sure that the PLD knows that his job is to balance hate with you and let you tank as much as you can. At 60, PLD/war can hold hate over most NINs, but he'll sponge up mp if he does.

PLD/war is best for Ultima during the wild phase. Invincible (after CCB!) is great for grabbing hate fast and holding it long enough for everyone to slay it.

BTW, if your NIN has full merits and top gear for 60, it's quite possible to build up enough agro from DD that the PLD won't be able to pull it off you at all. That's OK, though. Pile-pitch will eventually fix that and let your cotank shine.

Post by **Shirai** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:09 am

I could be mistaken but I thought Flash, Cure IV and Sentinel built enough hate these days to make pld/nin a viable co-tank even in the 60's.

If not my mistake as I don't have pld leveled yet.

Post by **Sugami** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 11:28 am

Well the THF only had THF leveled and his Dagger hits weren't cutting it, hence trying /RNG. Anyways he's buggered off to Canada now (what's that all aboot, ey?) so we need to find someone to replace him.

The NIN is me, I don't have any enmity, evasion or Katana merits, only maxed crits that don't really help. We'll probably try March to counter the uber Slow next time

Post by **Shirai** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:44 pm

Sugami wrote:The NIN is me, I don't have any enmity, evasion or Katana merits, only maxed crits that don't really help. We'll probably try March to counter the uber Slow next time

Don't worry too much about enmity merits.
See if you can borrow a pair of Eris' earrings (+1 would even be better), at least on titan they aren't cheap.
Maxed crits are more helpful then you think when it comes to keeping hate do not underestamate that!

Chemical bomb will overwrite Haste and double march btw no matter what.
This really needs a double erase before you can reapply either.
(I know on one of the fights I did to help people Ultima used this on pull and hit the whole party with it, that really sucked!)

Okuza · Post by **Okuza** » Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:26 pm

Merits that help you keep hate as a NIN: katana/8, crit/4, eva/4, str/5. Enmity is nice, but unless you only care about playing NIN,PLD,THF (maybe war), it's really foolish to get.

The problem with PLD60/nin isn't so much getting hate as what they do with it once they have it. They only have :ichi at 60. I'm also not sure how much enmity a 60 PLD can wear. The way a 75 PLD/nin makes all those hate tools work is by wearing a lot of enmity.

Still all you really care about is to have him bounce hate a little. If he cures you when you take damage, he can hold long enough for you to get blinks back up. And, he could always invincible for the finale.

Post by **Sugami** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:53 pm

Thought I'd ressurect this thread yet again as we attempted it today.

Omega & Ultima 4 - Us 1

The party setup: NIN(me), DRK, SAM, BLM, WHM, BRD.

Mammets: Slightly different this time, I ran around in circles until the SAM and DRK each had one and I only had one left, then I turned and faught. AoEs were annoying but it went by smoothly.

Omega: Went well until my macro refused to work and I got hit with enstun, and again right when it wore stopping me from casting, and then I died

luckily he was almost dead and everyone went nuts to finish him off.

Ultima: Again went well, uber Slow not so much of a problem with WHM ontop of Erase and double March. Hate turned out to be the major problem eventually claiming both WHM, who got up and continued shortly later, and BLM who died righ before our adorable little SAM slapped Ultima with a Tachi: Yukikaze and finished off the SOB

Post by **Shirai** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:16 am

Congrats!
You have the most dificult mission in CoP behind you.

The rest is a walk in the park compared to this.