WHY this is just the wrong thing to do

Liohs · Post by **Liohs** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 8:12 am

http://www.mysupersales.com/

the fact that this place hasnt bin shut down boggles me GRRRRR
i dont know whats worce the pices for gil or that ppl would pay then

i hope Square does something about it soon

Sirc · Post by **Sirc** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 1:52 pm

Wow! $620 for 2M gil?

I'm still grumbling about the $13 I have to pay each month just to play the game.

Klenath · Post by **Klenath** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 2:21 pm

That's just SAD.

Post by **Alya Mizar (Tsybil)** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 5:10 pm

Squenix should shut those places down. They can as it plainly states in the agreement that selling in game things for real world cash WILL result in loss of account & other bad things.

Want to make a RL living from video games? Everquest.

BTW do you know that these places are often fueled by sweatshops in Mexico where people are paid to play video games? 12 hours a day folowing scripts designed to earn max gill/hour.

Sirc · Post by **Sirc** » Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:16 am

Tsybil wrote:BTW do you know that these places are often fueled by sweatshops in Mexico where people are paid to play video games? 12 hours a day folowing scripts designed to earn max gill/hour.

LMAO!

Zaltana · Post by **Zaltana** » Tue Jun 29, 2004 5:07 am

shades of the old Diablo2 ebay selling of accounts. pathetic.

Ishe · Post by **Ishe** » Tue Jun 29, 2004 10:01 am

I dunno, I'd be more than happy to make a few hundred bucks off my char when I'm through with the game. Why the heck not? ^^ But that won't be for a while...having too much fun right now hehe

Post by **Cyndari** » Tue Jun 29, 2004 6:06 pm

Man that is really horrible

but whats worse than that is the way Liohs butchered the English language

hahahaha just kidding Liohs

Syine · Post by **Syine** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 3:40 am

It's kinda depressing. People selling in-game assets are encouraging spoiled idiots with more RL cash than interest in experiencing the game to play. It lowers the quality for everyone else. So, please, when you leave the game, don't ruin it for those of us who stay. Don't try to profit off of FFXI's destruction.

As for the companies that manage these black market exchanges, they pretty much get what they deserve. Do you really want to have to explain yourself if one of these outfits rips you off?

Baketsu · Post by **Baketsu** » Sat Jan 22, 2005 12:50 am

Maybe we need limits to the bazaaar prices? Maybe the prices per item should be as follows:

If I buy a Bronze Subligar for 1000 gil from a NPC, then the auction house price cannot exceed 3 times that amount. So I could never pay more than 3000 for a bronze subligar, (that is assuming i would ever buy such a horrendous piece of armor known as a bronze subligar).

Although the idea of price controls scare me as well.

Another way could be having someone in square scanning the net (ebay, and other online auction house sites) and writing down the user names of these GIL farmers and banning them and seizing their assets and placing them on the auction house for the LOWEST bidder!!!!! That would show them!!!

Another way would be to start a coalition of our own Gil farmers that would find out what item of the week to ruin and ruin the price ont he auction house by underselling, but that could backfire on you too.

Dot Hack never had this problem, but then again it wasn't hooked up to the internet either.

Real World wealth should never translate into Online World wealth ever! But that is my opinion of it.

Prrsha · Post by **Prrsha** » Sat Jan 22, 2005 2:24 pm

Square will be taking legal action against the gil sellers soon. Just be patient.

The fishing bots will be solved soon with a rework of the fishing system as well. The only thing needed after that would be a cash reset to fix the economy.

mozyr · Post by **mozyr** » Sun Jan 23, 2005 6:58 pm

I'm surprised that this hasn't been mentioned here already:

These people are buying FAKE money.

With REAL money.

.........why?

Idiots. That just boggles me. Why the hell would you spend $620 (that's about two paychecks for me) on FAKE money? You're not going to get anything out of it other than being able to buy fake things on a fake game.

-- Sarah

Eviticus · Post by **Eviticus** » Sun Jan 23, 2005 7:13 pm

We play the game for fun. By playing the game, we can earn gil which we use to enrigh our characters, allowing us to do more. Therefore Gil furthers our ability to have fun in this game for some.

Thus, buying gil may improve our ability to have fun in this game.

They are spending real life money to have fun. So do we all. The monthly charge is also real life money we are spending to have fun.

Gil selling is just another route. Though illegal.

Kandora · Post by **Kandora** » Sun Jan 23, 2005 7:21 pm

Just to be a smart ass, I'm going to point out that the US dollar has been "fake" for years.

Prrsha · Post by **Prrsha** » Sun Jan 23, 2005 7:25 pm

Both gil buying and selling is against the law in the US. It is considered theft and exploitation (for profit) of intellectual property. It's considered a felony in the US.

Aony · Post by **Aony** » Sun Jan 23, 2005 8:40 pm

Eviticus wrote:We play the game for fun. By playing the game, we can earn gil which we use to enrigh our characters, allowing us to do more. Therefore Gil furthers our ability to have fun in this game for some.

Thus, buying gil may improve our ability to have fun in this game.

They are spending real life money to have fun. So do we all. The monthly charge is also real life money we are spending to have fun.

Gil selling is just another route. Though illegal.

but u know, getting the gil by crafting, or farming, or whatever is part of what makes the game fun! After all the hard work you do, when you finally buy that super-expensive item it gives you a sense of accomplishment, while buying the gil gives you a kind of "well at least i got what i wanted" feeling.

Also (correct me if i'm wrong i've never bought gil) it takes time for them to get your order, schedule a meeting, and run over to give you the gil. In this time (unless you're buying rediculus amounts of gil, costing about $2,000) you would have made a good amount of that money other ways without costing you one cent.

(quote from school after our daily "words of wisdom" from the guidance councelor) "with something to think about, this is Aony reminding you the choices you make today help shape your world tommorow"

Eviticus · Post by **Eviticus** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:16 am

"well at least i got what i wanted"

Yeah, I had that feeling out the wazoo when I equipped my Republic Subligar today. ^.^ Hot Pants of Attack, +5.

But anyways, about the US Dollar being fake, tis true. That green paper is based on the hopes and dreams of the american people. Alan Greenspan sits behind his desk every day and sacrafices a goat in hopes people won't realize that a quarter has more value then a dollar if you actually view it as it's components.

Then again, when we did base it on physical wealth, we got a stock market crash after a while. Huh, figure that one out.

Baketsu · Post by **Baketsu** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:27 am

Eviticus wrote:"well at least i got what i wanted"

Yeah, I had that feeling out the wazoo when I equipped my Republic Subligar today. ^.^ Hot Pants of Attack, +5.

But anyways, about the US Dollar being fake, tis true. That green paper is based on the hopes and dreams of the american people. Alan Greenspan sits behind his desk every day and sacrafices a goat in hopes people won't realize that a quarter has more value then a dollar if you actually view it as it's components.

Then again, when we did base it on physical wealth, we got a stock market crash after a while. Huh, figure that one out.

HOT PANTS OF DEATH!! LOL, I actually thoguht of getting some, until I noted the name "Subligar" and the bad memories related to that word, then i thought, well my currents pants may not protect me as much, but i look better in them being an Elvaan male, so I am gonna hold out on getting subligar unless it is really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really really nessassry

Kandora wrote:Just to be a smart ass, I'm going to point out that the US dollar has been "fake" for years.

LOL, guess what? North Korea has been "gil selling" for quite some time!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superdollar

Maybe we are all a small part of a much bigger MMORPG that existes in a higher level universe....... Either that or I should cut back on the LSD ^^

Post by **Tivia** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 3:10 pm

Mysupersales otherwise known as Yantis is based out of hong Kong, they have had legal action attempted against them by, Verant, EA and darn near every single other Major gaming company with a virtual economy. Due to the law system of where they are based out of, they are untouchable at this time.

Long story short, there is not a thing SE can do about it, except remove the mechanics of how people make gil easily, which in turn screws the casual gamer even more for making gil, pushing the Demand up, thus raising the cost of gil and increasing the profit margin for gil sellers. So because there are more then a few people wanting to purchase gil, because they do not want to invest the time into the game, any effort SE makes to curb the problem at this point only compounds the issue.

Post by **Alya Mizar (Tsybil)** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 4:53 pm

Tivia wrote:....Long story short, there is not a thing SE can do about it, except remove the mechanics of how people make gil easily....

No. Squenix has identifed whole groups of Gil Farmers and deleted them, their accounts, their IP adress too. The Jerry series on ummm.... I forget the server for one. Their methodoligy has changed as well. On Garuda, the Wst series has all gone in for Fishing, and there is a new fishing group as well.

Kinda sad realy, grown men and women hired to replace fishbots....

I suspect one of the problems is stafing.

Prrsha · Post by **Prrsha** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 5:05 pm

Square is banning the gil sellers as quickly as they can when identified. The new fishing system will help with all of the fish bots. But like I said, I don't see AH prices going back to normal until they reset everyone's gil (which I hope they do as it needs to be done).

The fishing bots are the #1 cause for gil inflation in the game. They sell more items to NPCs then any other player ever could. There are 4 ways cash is added to the game (which causes gil inflation).

#1 Selling an item to an NPC.
#2 Quests.
#3 Gil dropped from beastmen.
#4 Treasure chests and coffers.

There are several ways cash is removed from the game:

#1 Chocobo/airship costs.
#2 Buying an item from an NPC.
#3 AH taxes.
#4 A player leaving the game and taking his gil with him.

Now granted I don't like any gilsellers whatsoever, but the real ones causing harm to the game are the fishers. The NM camping gilsellers and miners all sell their items to the AH. Due to the AH taxes, they are actually removing cash from the game. The fishers add cash to the game in mass amounts.

Sigyn · Post by **Sigyn** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:27 pm

Prrsha wrote:Both gil buying and selling is against the law in the US. It is considered theft and exploitation (for profit) of intellectual property. It's considered a felony in the US.

Cite please.

Dukuji · Post by **Dukuji** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:46 pm

Prrsha wrote:The new fishing system will help with all of the fish bots.

New fishing system eh? I've heard this mentioned before. Where can I go to learn more about this new fishing system?

/em goes to get her fishing rod out of the closet but remembers that she sold it away back for a new katana.

oh . . .

Prrsha · Post by **Prrsha** » Mon Jan 24, 2005 11:58 pm

Here:

Regarding Real Money Trade (Dec.

With respect to game titles operated by the PlayOnline service, including FINAL FANTASY XI, it is specifically prohibited to sell game currency, characters, or any other in-game items for real money or any other consideration for value (known as Real Money Trade "RMT"). This prohibition is expressly referred to in the following two clauses, which are part of the respective agreements which all registered users of the FINAL FANTASY XI and/or PlayOnline services have agreed to abide by:

*PlayOnline Member Agreement: Article 4.4
*FINAL FANTASY XI User Agreement: Article 3.1

This prohibition is due to the possibility of fraud during transaction in the real world which may lead to legal sanctions, including possible criminal sanctions, being imposed on those involved in such trade. In addition, Real Money Trade was not initially a part of the design for any of our game titles.

We are already investigating this issue and putting into effect appropriate measures for such actions within the game environment, and we will continue to do so in the future. Players found to be participating in Real Money Trade will be deemed to be in breach of the clauses set out above and will be subject to any appropriate legal sanction. We expressly reserve our rights in the event of such a breach, including the right to cancel the PlayOnline account of any user in breach of the clauses above, without any prior notice to such user.

Many of you have recently made GM calls or contacted the Information Center to report such Real Money Trades taking place at various online auction sites. Please note, however, that our ability to take appropriate action in such cases is very often dependent on the cooperation of the respective websites, which is not within our control. While we are grateful for your help, please note that it is not necessary to make a GM call or to contact the Information Center to report such issues.

While it is not possible to change our policy regarding Real Money Trades for any current online Square Enix title, it is possible that our policy might change for future titles, although no decision in that respect has yet been made.

Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.

Prrsha · Post by **Prrsha** » Tue Jan 25, 2005 12:00 am

I'll dig up the other square post about the theft of intellectual prop in a bit. I need to find it again on their site.

Post by **Alya Mizar (Tsybil)** » Tue Jan 25, 2005 3:03 am

Two small points.

The new guild items remove Gil, or value, from the game. Inflation is caused by too many gil chasing too few items. Removing the excess gil seems like it would help, but there is the problem, not of the Gil farmers, nor the Gil sellers, but the Gil buyers. When prices jump, as they did recently, it is almost always right after IGE has cut prices.

The ability to buy gil with dollars has thrown all economic theory out the window. Gil has a different intrinsic value to the person who earns it in game, the person who earns the cash to buy it IRL, and the person with indulgent parents.

On the intilectual properity thing, I do not believe that has been settled in court. The code IS inteluctual property, the art as well, music too. But in game items, earned or made by the player... that is still grey area. Were it not, no mater where the Gil farmers reside, the outlets here in the USA who sell the stuff are in posesion of stolen items, and can be INSTANTLY shut down, not only with a lawsuit, but criminal charges.

Prrsha · Post by **Prrsha** » Tue Jan 25, 2005 1:47 pm

The problem is that most of the gillselling companies don't reside in the US. China's history of enforcement of copyright laws is shady at best.

MithraPride

WHY this is just the wrong thing to do

WHY this is just the wrong thing to do

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