MithraPride

http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2011/01/p ... 3-exploit/

Tivia wrote:Love the PS3, hate Sony because they are a bunch of monkeys who shafted me out of my linux running ps3 out of fear of piracy.

Your Linux PS3 is OTW kitty.

Still going to be a while before anything comes of it. I was aware this had happened recently, but was unsure the depth of control it afforded. That said, this particular quote is an absolute Gem..I hope someone sets this as the screensaver on every Sony computer in their corp.

So what took these hackers so long? Members of the fail 0verflow team — a collaboration of hackers and coders best known for cracking the Wii and executing unsigned code on Nintendo’s console — said Sony’s removal of Linux on the console was the impetus they needed to get on and hack it.

And now come the lawyers.....

Sony Attempt to 'Restrain' PlayStation 3 Hackers Doomed?

Won't matter. Apple tried the same thing over the iPhone jail break and lost and sony has already been down this road with their akimbo programmable dog and lost. This will turn out exactly the same. It is nothing more then legal posturing to deter people from it.

Sony needs new lawyers. Not that I think they stand much chance, but just read this post:

No court order against PlayStation hackers for now

He filed in San Francisco against a New Jersey resident. The legal reasoning he used is truly comic. I wonder how the judge kept a straight face.

Wow, what a dumbass. I am just barely getting started in law school and I knew that was an asinine argument. To think this guy actually passed the bar, this is going to be easier then I thought.

They had to do something, if only for show. I realise that the MSM typically misses the point in almost every tech related story (iPhone antennagate anyone? iPad?) but in certain circles, ppl are praising Sony's engineers. This is by far, the longest that any DRM has survived (in the stand-alone area). You can't stop piracy/etc. but if you can delay it long enough without overly annoying your customers, that is a billion dollar achievement and online is still mostly protected.

Also you could've gotten by with the dongle around August of last year, so all the PR stuff Sony's putting out... it's hype to let shareholders know that the lights are on. Not sure? Go google for PS3 torrents and bear in mind the protection was broken over 4 months ago. In the meantime, in other less important news, Sony drops the cost of the PS3 production to sub $200. How much is one at Best Buy? If only normal employee discounts could get one at cost... $200 for a BDR player with upgradeable HDD to playback mkv anime. And it plays games

Oh I know, the fact that it took this long to crack the PS3 is a pretty impressive feat.

All I really want myself is the option to install linux again and I would like HDMI-CEC enabled on my original PS3's. I have zero need to pirate games myself as I am almost always going to buy the few game series I play and I just rent everything else. However losing my linux box and being told that "Yea the hardware supports it, but we don't want to allow hdmi-cec on the original models" just pisses me off to be honest. Especially given I paid $600 for both of my machines while people now paying a pissant $300 get functionality that I should as well.

Tivia, there is a class action suit against Sony for removing things that once were sales points. I suggest joining it.

I give it a far greater chance of success than Sony's lawsuit. After all, this is taking bait and switch to a whole new level.

Its like taking a dead stock factory hot rod in for service and getting it back with an anemic 4 banger replacing the turbo V6 because some people got speeding tickets.

Alya Mizar (Tsybil) wrote:Tivia, there is a class action suit against Sony for removing things that once were sales points. I suggest joining it.

I give it a far greater chance of success than Sony's lawsuit. After all, this is taking bait and switch to a whole new level.

Its like taking a dead stock factory hot rod in for service and getting it back with an anemic 4 banger replacing the turbo V6 because some people got speeding tickets.

I am aware of it and believe me I did.

Dunno, if it would do much good. The fine print and EULAs covered them well. Mind you, I would PAY for them to put back the Emotion engine as well as 'Other OS' support. I know they took them out to save money, but they can just put them back in and charge more to compensate and people will buy it. Heck, the USAF will. Sony's decision made sense when each PS3 costs $800. It made sense when their lawyers told them the fine print allowed them to patch away Other OS.... but when you actually make money selling just the console?

Then again... what if they were to do something that already has been done in the PC world... DRM ala 'always online' like what Ubisoft did. Or sell a game for $10... DLCs for $10 each... lol. I would not be suprised if in 10 years time, we pay for games... by the minute.

It likely won't do much good, though it does keep the hope alive that other OS will make a come back. Especially now that it is proven to have zero effect on piracy and remains a customer service issue for them. I also want them to freaking enable HDMI-CEC in the original PS3 as well. I know the bloody thing will support it, they just have it disabled. I know how to enable it, but I rather prefer not to tear my ps3 apart unless I absolutely need too.

That said, I am gonna be highly upset when my PS3 dies. At this point it is damn near irreplaceable. My 60gb one at least, the 80gb is a not quite as hard but will still be annoying.

A Good Hacker can get around anything. How do you think I saved the unlock fee by cracking my Blackberry Torch and having Sprint Put their network on it. This is not illegal btw, since I bought the phone from blackberry and paid sprint to use with. Btw, Sprint themselves told me that if I could unlock the Torch myself, that I should do it or they were going to charge me to do it. My own carrier told me to do it heh.

Asphe wrote:Dunno, if it would do much good. The fine print and EULAs covered them well.

WHAT??? Asphe, were this not all in English I would say something was lost in translation.

Lets say I sold you a car with a ROCKING stereo system, private sale, but I named every component on the Craig's List add. Then a year or so later, with a duplicate set of keys, I removed it all. What fine print would make this not theft? How is what Sony did any different? But hey, you still have the car, right?

Asphe wrote:I know they took them out to save money

OK, this is another what??? All those units were out the door. How did this save them money? It COST them money to do it.

Asphe wrote:but they can just put them back in and charge more to compensate and people will buy it.

This would be a slap on the face. With a 900 LB (400 kg) halibut. Yes they do grow that big. Unlike gorillas.

My best friend, a platform and PC gamer said "Sony could rule the world if they didn't have their (paraphrase: wearing their anal sphincter for a necklace)"

Remember when Apple sued over the unlocked iPhones that people were taking to their own carriers? Remember the courts saying "This is not illegal?" Sony doesn't have a leg to stand on if that gets brought up in court.

Alya Mizar (Tsybil) wrote: WHAT??? Asphe, were this not all in English I would say something was lost in translation.

Lets say I sold you a car with a ROCKING stereo system, private sale, but I named every component on the Craig's List add. Then a year or so later, with a duplicate set of keys, I removed it all. What fine print would make this not theft? How is what Sony did any different? But hey, you still have the car, right?

Thing is, they didn't sell you a car, then repossessed parts of it. If anything, they 'removed' a part that most ppl didn't use which carefully annoyed just a small if vocal segment of consumers and yes, it was covered by the EULA which paraphrased reads like 'we can do anything we want, with short notice'. Noone has successfully won a case against them taking out Other OS support yet. You'd think taking out the Emotion Engine would cause a big enough backlash... and what happens? Ppl pay millions to Sony to download PS3 versions of PS2 favourites. What do you think Sony is going to do? Be nice or continue to give us the shaft?

Alya Mizar (Tsybil) wrote:

Asphe wrote:I know they took them out to save money

OK, this is another what??? All those units were out the door. How did this save them money? It COST them money to do it.

I'm referring to units not out of the door yet. It saved them money. That's why I still have one unopened PS3 in my office, it's the 1st gen model kept as backup for our remaining working model. If that one breaks down, our supplier will replace it.. with a Slim...

Add to that, TS no longer needs to 'support' the 'cut' features. Ever call tech support for a major OEM, asking why so and so app won't work on their stuff? "Sorry, we don't support that." ring a bell?

Alya Mizar (Tsybil) wrote:

Asphe wrote:but they can just put them back in and charge more to compensate and people will buy it.

This would be a slap on the face. With a 900 LB (400 kg) halibut. Yes they do grow that big. Unlike gorillas.

My best friend, a platform and PC gamer said "Sony could rule the world if they didn't have their (paraphrase: wearing their anal sphincter for a necklace)"

We've been slapped in the face and other unmentionables before, it hasn't stopped them doing it again and again. As long as they pick on the small guy, we... in the main let it slide. Meanwhile, it's business as usual. As it was in the past, it shall be in the future.

Karou Ariyen wrote:Remember when Apple sued over the unlocked iPhones that people were taking to their own carriers? Remember the courts saying "This is not illegal?" Sony doesn't have a leg to stand on if that gets brought up in court.

They did bring it up in court, if only for show. They know that enough ppl will 'comply' to make it worth throwing a few grand on some low-life lawyers. Now if you read the newer contracts, they try to cover that too. Not everyone is willing to make the effort to fight Apple. Hopefully we won't see "we sell you the service, hardware is provided to support that service" sort of stuff. Just like M$'s "You bought a license to use the software, not the actual software".

If you buy an iPhone4 in Singapore (dirt cheap compared to the US), you are locked into a contract there. Same with RIM and a host of other stuff. So I use a Samsung Android device. If I don't like what a corp does, I'll try to 'punish' them for it, if only in my small way.

Corps do this all the time, and not just on things that are noticeable. I used to own nothing but Accura Integras... and was not happy the 'frog-eyes' was removed at one point in the model line. It was a feature that could be cranky but most drivers like it... so Honda removed it anyway. The sun-roof size got cut down as well. How many of you tried to hack PVR features into Sat-TV boxes only to see them get 'bricked'? Or the online-always features of games. I can't play ME2 at Narita unless I pony up 2800 yen to get online so I can activate it... so I can play while waiting on the plane. I have to make sure I put the PC on hibernate so I can play in the air later.

Well I won't complain too much, I'm pretty sure crap like this is why I have my job ^-^ Enough people are annoyed enough to pay for alternatives and that's where my company makes it's dough. Not that we are the good guys either, we pay almost no taxes at all by operating in various countries that have an agreement not to tax us. At least we don't enslave children or traffic drugs. I think.

In the meantime, I'm shopping around in Singapore for that PS3 Dongle ^-^.

And one they win.

Sony wins temporary restraining order in PS3 hacking lawsuit

Kind of a useless victory, seeing as how they are trying to put a genie back in a bottle. And its a temporary order anyway meaning it can be put aside while lawyers argue (and collect fees).

Further proof that the PS3 is only useable as a brick. Just like the Wii and 360 are bricks. PC Onry.

Alya Mizar (Tsybil) wrote:And one they win.

Sony wins temporary restraining order in PS3 hacking lawsuit

Kind of a useless victory, seeing as how they are trying to put a genie back in a bottle. And its a temporary order anyway meaning it can be put aside while lawyers argue (and collect fees).

I'm sure that order will stick.. and be tottally useless. What was broken is the core of it all. They can never fix this without invalidating all the current games, and if they tried that, lawyers would crucify them. But it's to show shareholders something is being done. Having it last so many years is worth billions in revenue.

Karou Ariyen wrote:Further proof that the PS3 is only useable as a brick. Just like the Wii and 360 are bricks. PC Onry.

Thing is, the consoles are winning. When I was barely 10 years old, I played Fighter Ace and X-Wing on MS's gaming zone. PC games that pretty much required a joystick. Nowadays, these are very small niches. Eventually the PC will be the console or vice versa. By then, we'd probably have to pay per GB for internet usage too. Did you see what the UBB in Canada manage to get the politicos to pass? How soon before that hits the US. It's like raising the price of gas because oil prices... fell.

Did you see what the UBB in Canada manage to get the politicos to pass? How soon before that hits the US. It's like raising the price of gas because oil prices... fell.

I'm not aware of this.. what happened in Canada?

Their equivalent of the FCC allowed a 'backbone' provider (similar to out AT&T or Sprint) to change how they charge by usage. Mind you, the smaller ISPs already pay the backbone providers by how much they use but this change means that the costs will go way up and it will be passed on to consumers.

Typical consumer plan is unlimited bandwidth with 250GB cap. If the changes go through (the Canadian PM/Cabinet has stepped in to stop it), it will be more like a 20-60GB cap with hefty penalty charges for going over the cap.

This is a piece of crap thing too. iPhone users in NA are liberally shafted by AT&T's overcharging on their data plans. You can just leave your iPhone on standby for a month and end up paying data charges for it.

Asphe wrote:You can just leave your iPhone on standby for a month and end up paying data charges for it.

Which happens to be fraud and someone has called them on it.

Those companies we used to call telcos (telephone companies) are beyond slimy. My experiences with Qwest's customer service have all been pleasant. But their billing department RELIES on out and out fraud.

Details on request.

We already have that... It's called Net Neutrallity. That thing that allows comcast and everyone else to charge "Tier Internet Usage" and "Block high bandwidth." It was supposed to stop the government from interfering. Instead it's a money making device that blocks the FCC from doing their job and regulating the internet corporations.

EDIT: I meant Internet Service Providers not "Corporations" in case anyone confuses them with say, Amazon dot com.

Yeah, I love those arguments.

We need Net Neutrality or the ISP will charge us extra to access free porn sites. aka the Toll-Road argument.

or

Net Neutrality means all of you will get slow access when some of you bandwidth hogs (I mean you nasty p2p people) can and should pay for such access aka the Traffic-Jam/HOV Lane argument.

Sadly, I see a few countries implementing a bit of both, the funny thing is although it's true that people are 'trending upwards' in terms of bandwidth consumption, the costs in terms of absolute cost per customer as well as cost per GB/s is dropping... and dropping quickly so both arguments are dumb. The real issues are "I don't want to pay" vs "I want you to pay". They really should just offer 'basic' and p2p plans and avoid government intervention altogether. In the meantime, proxy providers are making a mint.

My argument is simple.

My plan states "Unlimited". If they have trouble understanding the definition of unlimited they can easily pull it up in the dictionary.

Now if they no longer want to sell unlimited, then that is their right. However users like me are grandfathered in and they are going to have to suck it up. So they need to quit advertising limited internet connections as unlimited or they need to quit pissing and moaning about it. Frankly I am surprised no one has sued the sh*t out of the major ISP's for bait and switch tactics.

Alya Mizar (Tsybil) wrote:

Asphe wrote:You can just leave your iPhone on standby for a month and end up paying data charges for it.

Which happens to be fraud and someone has called them on it.

Those companies we used to call telcos (telephone companies) are beyond slimy. My experiences with Qwest's customer service have all been pleasant. But their billing department RELIES on out and out fraud.

Details on request.

And yet I did testing. Comcast gives the same amount of bandwidth on Tiers 1 through 3. I've used them all. There is no speed difference, just a price tag difference. Without FCC Control on the Tier systems, companies are doing what Comcast is, lying about the service tiers to make money. There is no regulation with or without Net Nuetrallity. All it is, is an uncontrolled money making scheme. Why can't we find a way to at least regulate these companies so they can't Rob Peter to Pay Paul.

By the way, my comcast runs SLOWER on all tiers since their instation. My net used to run so much faster back in the day when they first took over Media One.

Did you check the changes they made in routing? Their costs go down, our bills go up... unless you're a business customer with a big wallet. Then you're golden. I probably pay 10% of what a residential customer pays for the same bandwidth with about 33% less hops too. Maybe neighbourhoods or cities can band together and get even better deals. Kinda reminds you of the crap Enron pulled, manufacturing the electricity problems in California.

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I remember buying LD calls at .43/min as a residential customer... or .18/min as a business customer. This was reversed in the NY zip-codes so I had calls rerouted based on that. I really don't know if more regulation is the answer. Part of me wants to say, 'let the chips fall where they may' and just let all the providers do what they want. But this business is too hard for small timers to break in, even outfits like Virgin are being pressured into behaving the same way. In places where we think this is 'done right', it was government subsidies that brokered the way.

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AT&T's data plan? They are being sued. But think of how long those alaskans had to wait for before they won their case against the Exxon Valdez spill? (and they lost the appeal incidentally). They could've just given everyone a $3 monthly rebate to more than cover it and get lots of goodwill in the process... but no... Hard to blame AT&T... how many of the current customers know... or even care.

LOL... I miss IBM. Sometimes they did things right (other times, they charged 10x normal and messed it up).


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So... why do you need unlimited 20MB plan vs 5MB plan? 4 times faster right? Nope. They are covered on this against misleading advertising but thank goodness the 'unlimited' part is so far air-tight. Unless you're Canadian.

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Unlimited plans... you know what they are pulling now? You do get unlimited but they crash your latency and connectivity. Which is a technical way of capping you... just legally. Like those p2p throttling/etc. (so you're a heavy bandwidth user? You're a pirate then and I can cap you! Hah!) aka 'collective punishment' lol. Have to keep suing them or they'll keep slipping it in. Other countries are doing away with cable/copper voice and going to VOIP/VOD... There are already more internet users in the PRC...

Comcast is one of the worst internet/cable companies out there and everyone knows it. I read an article once called "How not to run a company successfully." Comcast has played games too much over the years and their Xfinity whitewash isn't helping either. But back on track here.

Sony fails to understand that by having linux support back on the ps3 that gives them MORE CUSTOMERS. People think it's a small niche, but considering the lack of quality games on the PS3, the linux community makes up for it in sales of the console. If Sony wants to drive their fans away like Microsoft is doing with their piece of crap XBL, than their complete morons. Sony c hose to sink half their business into the PS3 where-as MS still has Windo.....Excuse me while I burst out laughing here.

Sony made a bonehead move and they know it. But they won't admit it publically, they'll play the blame game to make themselves look like an innocent victim. To sony "Anti-Piracy" is a buzz word. Explain to me how I'm pirating games that I privately rip from my Sega Genesis Carts (I own the Super Magic Drive so I can do it) and play them on my PSP w/o uploading them, Sony. How is that piracy? The law states that emulators may be owned on consoles that are not in production and making money. So Sony's Anti-Piracy claim is now shot to hell. I think it's all about what it was from the dawn of time.... Money. God forbid sony loses money.