Does this happen to every WHM?

[Keavy]

Okay, so to reduce hate and conserve MP I use Regen spells as my WHM. For example: Puller took some hate and ran out of Bloody bolts so i'll toss a Regen on him/her. As soon as I cast it, I see the backup healer throw a Cure 2/3 on them. EVERYTIME!

Now I wait until we heal to calmly explain to them in /tell about my Regen strategy and ask them to not cure on top of it unless the person is in severe trouble and I'm distracted keeping someone else alive. Yet even after I explain it a few fights later it happens again and again I calmly explain that they are wasting my MP and theirs by doing this.

If it happens again after that I just give up.

Anyways, please tell me that this is the norm and I'm not some exception because the Goddess of Vana'Diel doesn't want me to be a WHM.

[Sugami]

Sounds like your backup healer is a noob
On RDM I'd only toss a Cure III or IV if someone goes below 50% and is in trouble. You should Regen your tank at the start of each fight if you're not doing that already unless ninja tank as they don't take hits regularly.

[Shirai]

Okay, so to reduce hate and conserve MP I use Regen spells as my WHM. For example: Puller took some hate and ran out of Bloody bolts so i'll toss a Regen on him/her. As soon as I cast it, I see the backup healer throw a Cure 2/3 on them. EVERYTIME!

Now I wait until we heal to calmly explain to them in /tell about my Regen strategy and ask them to not cure on top of it unless the person is in severe trouble and I'm distracted keeping someone else alive. Yet even after I explain it a few fights later it happens again and again I calmly explain that they are wasting my MP and theirs by doing this.

If it happens again after that I just give up.

Anyways, please tell me that this is the norm and I'm not some exception because the Goddess of Vana'Diel doesn't want me to be a WHM.

Sounds to me like the back up healer might have been a healer somewhere themselves.
As whm I'm a perfectionist, my party will not go in yellow except for the tank and I have found myself the balance of curing/regening/resting during fights.
As smn if I have the privilege to party with a whm, I regret to say I'm the same.
If any partymember starts to get into yellow or lower I get off my tail and toss in a cure.
I can't help it, it's a force of habbit that's in me from my whm job

It's not because I don't trust the whm, it's just because I want to help out.
As whm I never had trouble if the rdm/brd/smn or whatever /whm or healing class threw in a cure to help me out tho.

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

As a WHM I like to use Regen. Occasionaly I have found a party where I can do up to 80% of my healing with Regen.

As a RDM, when people hit yellow, I throw off a Cure. At my current level it is a C III.

When I play my Elvaan PLD, I don't want to be Cured till after I throw a Cure II on myself, and prefer to stay in the yellow. Usually the Healers get it the second or third time I tell them. As a RDM it is so hard not to throw a Cure the PLDs way....

It ain't you Keavy, its all the rest of us.

[Sugami]

Hehe really? PLD tank I let the WHM and PLD take care of him unless he's in the red I'm one of those RDM that hate healing.
Hint for when you get Cure IV, don't use it

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

Hint for when you get Cure IV, don't use it

I have it. Mostly I don't.

[Nivez]

cure 3 - 4 is my most used cure >.>

[Shirai]

Staple Cures: Cure II and Cure III,
When trouble happens /ma "Cure V" <stpc>

the rest, Regen and Flash <3

[ScarlettPheonix]

I use Regen liberally in all my parties and wish that more whms would use it too. I also wish that rdms could get Regen II, but thats another story.

It could be they missed your original regen, or that they're trying to skill up healing magic. For the mages who don't normally party with a whm its most likely habit. Either way, its not really any reason to get bent out of shape over it. Speaking as an occasional main healer, I'm always thankful when I know that my support mages are keeping an eye on everyone's health. Even if it means the occasional over curing.

I've found myself getting a bit mean in my advanced levels. If a whm gets so upset by my tossing out a cure, and insists that he'll handle the healing with regens, cures, w/e I'm more then happy to let him do just that. Just don't get upset when I decide to concentrate on the other aspects of being a support mage and don't cure. No, that doesn't mean I'd stop 911healing. If anyone gets seriously hurt I jump in regardless of the micro-managing whm. I'm not that much of a diva rdm, yet anyway

[Sylphine]

I don't get to play WHM much since I have to level my RDM first.

Normally (If I am the main healer), I'll cast regen on all fighters who aren't at full HP and focus on healing the tanker.

But I have the same problem anyway. Whenever I cast regen, the other healer usually put Cure 2 or 3 on him/her almost every time...

The most often use Cure? Cure2 and Cure3...And Cure 4 if in emergency.

----------------------

Edit :

A mana burn pt make me feel like hell as a RDM........ 2 fighters and 4 mages. I have to refresh all other mages (who are all BLM), or sometimes if the tanker is a PLD it will even more like hell...(yes...refresh PLD too)

The reason why it's hell is just only refreshing others consumed over 1/3 of my MP. This doesn't count that I have to be the main healer. (PLD got hit almost all the time and the bad thing is sometimes the PLD never cure him/her self.

The hell pt is PLD DRK RDM BLM BLM BLM BLM. I got this pt twice...and it is absolutely hell...

[Kahvi]

Ya i see that happen alot.. and even as RDM I try to use Regen often as well. The thing that ticks me off is when I (as main healer) accidentally draw aggro from saving someone that accidentally took a nasty crit to the face, and then not having the backup healer heal me since i cant cast, lest i draw more aggro and keep the mob away from the tank.

That happened 3 times when I was leveling in a party in Lab.of.Onzozo a few days ago. I was ready to reach over there and strangle the scrawny neck of that usless tool of a hume.

[Sugami]

Normally (If I am the main healer), I'll cast regen on all fighters who aren't at full HP and focus on healing the tanker.

That's odd, it's very rare I'm asked to be main healer most parties are just interested in Refresh but I provide much much more Not uncommon for RDM healers in early levels, 41+ though you shouldn't be doing it.

A mana burn pt make me feel like hell as a RDM........ 2 fighters and 4 mages...

That's a weird manaburn. Usually it's just me and 5 other BLM, in anycase I only Refresh the ones with the lowest MP when I have the chance and we're still usually able to get chain 4 or 5.

The hell pt is PLD DRK RDM BLM BLM BLM BLM. I got this pt twice...and it is absolutely hell...

So PLD, DRK, RDM and BLMx4, that's 7 hehe

Manaburns will make you neglect your main priorities (i.e. Enfeebling) however you can still get the skillups from Sleeps and don't forget to join in with the nuking to finish it off occasionally, you want to keep your Elemental Magic up too

My macro setup only has Cure III and IV, 60+ Cure II becomes a bit pointless (I think) and 70+ Cure III is just a minor heal, I'm just glad when there's a WHM that knows how to use Cure V

About those crappy party setups, just reject them off hand. You don't need to put up with them you get plenty of invites (or should do) I leveled from around 60 to 72 without putting up my flag once and from 68 to 70ish my sub was also slightly gimp

[Shirai]

My macro setup only has Cure III and IV, 60+ Cure II becomes a bit pointless (I think) and 70+ Cure III is just a minor heal, I'm just glad when there's a WHM that knows how to use Cure V

Sky parties @ 75 with PLD, Regen III > Haste cycle > Flash > Rest
Cure II is still a viable cure tho, even 70+.
With regen III (Which I have merited) I hardly even need to cast cures on plds anymore.
Maybe when a smite hits hard but even then it's hardly an issue.

The cures they do to keep hate are more then enough.

[ScarlettPheonix]

That's odd, it's very rare I'm asked to be main healer most parties are just interested in Refresh but I provide much much more Not uncommon for RDM healers in early levels, 41+ though you shouldn't be doing it.

41+ is when the popular rdm+brd party set-ups become viable. Out of those two, rdm is generally the main healer. Same thing with blm+rdm and smn+rdm party set-ups. Rdms end up main healing more often then not in parties without whms.

You could argue that smn+rdm is the exception; that rdm is more of a support healer in that role, but I disagree. Summoners tend to main heal because of the wait time between bloodpacts, but I really believe that since Red Mages get the second highest healing spells and skills they should be taking on the role of main healer in the absence of a whm. In the high 50s-60s your most likely exping on monsters that have alot of status effects. They tend to hit like a truck too.

In a no whm party I prefer letting the smn, blm or brd take care of the status cures and emergency heals while I handle the heavy healing. Summoners that try to take care of everything as a main healer seldom have time to do any summoning. By taking over the heavy healing, a red mage can free them up enough to summon an avatar and sc, mb or buff the party with it.

So yea, I'd have loved to live on your world if you were able to level past 41 and rarely be asked to main heal. For the past 30 levels I'd say I've been main healer about 45-50% of the time.

[Keavy]

Like I said, even if I have a refresher the reason I use Regen mainly is to keep hate off me. Typically I stand next to the BLM or RDM who is MBing and that creates some attention in our direction and if I'm spamming cure's that's also going to bring unwanted attention.

Even with all the best +MP equipment I can afford and Roast Mushrooms (I am looking for something better) my MP is 555. With Flash taking 25 and Haste taking 40 I can't afford to waste a single MP which is why I get so bent out of shape and which is also why I come down so hard on PLD's who don't have good heavy armor and use +VIT/+DEF food and with Ninjas its the ones that have low +EVA gear, again don't use food and only use Utsusemi that feel my wrath.

I'm not a Tarutaru and even with the +hMP I get from Clear Mind, Seer's, Mushrooms, and my Pilgrim's I can only recover so much so fast and I will hit a point where I do bottom out and need a break. Its just that if everyone is on par then we can get longer chain's which means faster and greater experience which makes everyone happier.

I'm sure once I get to 51 and get my Dark and Light staves things will get better, its just now I'm in a rough patch with players who demand 6-7K exp an hour, Haste on Tank, all DD's and the puller, and of course status effects removed as soon as the enemy applies them yet when I run out of MP at a Chain 4 they blame me for not "Learning to conserve MP."

[Rakshasa]

One thing I love is when people try to tell me their ultimate party philosophy. There is no one way to manage your party. Many of you are on the right track by including "if... then" clauses like "If there is a PLD tank then I will refresh him," but there is no way I can sum up how I execute my job without typing a long, boring novel none of you would want to read. Each party is different, you must remain fluid like water~

I have one rule I abide by in any party with any job: It is not your job to please everyone in the party. It is your job to make sure EXP flows as quickly and smoothly as possible. Some of you may be thinking that the best EXP is what makes people happy, but just ask the BLM who gets 10K an hour without continuous refreshing.

There's no one way to do things and even if you could find "the perfect method" there's no way you can keep it up flawlessly for however many hours you are in a party. There are some parties, though, that you just need to dump 'cause there's no good way to make them flow properly. Be aggressive, yet humble in assuring decent EXP. As long as you can back up your actions with reason, your actions have ground to stand on. I see a lot of "whats" but not a lot of "whys" in the above posts.

[Sugami]

You could argue that smn+rdm is the exception; that rdm is more of a support healer in that role, but I disagree. Summoners tend to main heal because of the wait time between bloodpacts, but I really believe that since Red Mages get the second highest healing spells and skills they should be taking on the role of main healer in the absence of a whm. In the high 50s-60s your most likely exping on monsters that have alot of status effects. They tend to hit like a truck too.

You call yourself a RDM? I don't know any RDM that'd put themselves above SMN as a healer. Just because you have the spell doesn't mean you should use it frequently. Just 'cause you have enspells doesn't mean you should jump in with a sword. We have A+ in Enfeebling Magic for a reason, any RDM not regually throwing down the enfeebles isn't doing their job and if put on healing duty you just can't do it all.

You'll find a WHM or SMN easier than a RDM or BRD, trying to get both RDM and BRD in a party is pretty hard unless you know them personally. BLM + RDM != RDM healer, never ever ever!

I always prefer WHM healer to SMN, Regen III and Cure V are awesome and Raise II & III when things for bad.

On a server when you get 2 invites a minute, I think you can reject any main healing rolls and wait for the "proper" invites. I think this is pretty much the same across all servers.

[Keavy]

Like most people I get bored and if they got five people waiting i'll gladly join even as a main healer RDM or SMN.

I'm waiting for the party that lets me make the most of my BLM sub as WHM

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

Keavy, DON'T HASTE ANYONE BUT THE TANK.

This is why. You haste the tank to help him hold hate. If he loses hate it is more MPs than if he keeps it. You spend 40 MPs to help the other Melees rip hate off him. You wind up spending those extra ones too.

This goes double for NIN tanks.

As the WHM's MPs limit the chain, if you only haste the tank, the chains are longer. The kills may take longer, but I can't say.

[Yukira]

Meh...personally I see the most important thing in partying is that everyone has fun. That is primary, exp is secondary. Be nice to people; if they act like asses its their undoing, not yours.

A good party consists of people who encourage and support eachother in all situations.

[Rakshasa]

Keavy, DON'T HASTE ANYONE BUT THE TANK.

This is why. You haste the tank to help him hold hate. If he loses hate it is more MPs than if he keeps it. You spend 40 MPs to help the other Melees rip hate off him. You wind up spending those extra ones too.

This goes double for NIN tanks.

As the WHM's MPs limit the chain, if you only haste the tank, the chains are longer. The kills may take longer, but I can't say.

Thank you! I've always held to that one, although even this rule isn't set in stone. People don't seem to understand this and I've even explained why I wasn't hasting a Monk a while back in Onzozo (although this was also a RDM and BRD party with myself as main healer). If you have a really good tank, I don't see a problem with hasting DDs.

On the other end, I was leveling my WAR just yesterday and getting hasted all the time. I told the mages it wasn't necessary, but they kept it up. As a WAR I pull hate off all but the best of tanks (please keep the discussion of WAR as a DD for another thread). I didn't mind much since I do have shadows to rely on. If it ever gets out of hand I would tell them to stop hasting me.

There was a time someone mentioned hasting the THF to speed up SATA, but if I recall correctly haste doesn't speed up job abilities. I know for a fact it doesn't effect all of them (like Provoke). In that same party the RDM was asking for haste (I was the WHM)... about the last person I'd think of hasting. Sure, it'd speed up refresh cast time, but you don't need it if you form your RDM groove! She proceeded to stop refreshing me for the duration of the party. Don't ever withhold abilities for childish reasons, it affects everyone. -.-

~End Chapter One: Hasting~

[Sugami]

Hehe my reasons for not hasting are:
1. I don't have enough time.
2. I don't have enough MP.
3. I forget

If we have SMN healer and NIN tank then I have to Haste the NIN and I really try to remember at the start of each fight

[Sylphine]

That's odd, it's very rare I'm asked to be main healer most parties are just interested in Refresh but I provide much much more Not uncommon for RDM healers in early levels, 41+ though you shouldn't be doing it.

Well...I usually do that if there's no WHM...(At least when an AOE hit all other fighters and I don't have time to heal them up) Anyway, I still can't get rid of this habit.

That's a weird manaburn. Usually it's just me and 5 other BLM, in anycase I only Refresh the ones with the lowest MP when I have the chance and we're still usually able to get chain 4 or 5.

Yup, I suppose...But the reason the leader pulled me into the pt is he want me to refresh all BLMs...And yes, totally wired manaburn.

So PLD, DRK, RDM and BLMx4, that's 7 hehe

Sorry...I'm a bit sleepy when I was typing. It's already 2 o'clock back then. I want to tell that half of the pt was BLM. ><"

Manaburns will make you neglect your main priorities (i.e. Enfeebling) however you can still get the skillups from Sleeps and don't forget to join in with the nuking to finish it off occasionally, you want to keep your Elemental Magic up too

My macro setup only has Cure III and IV, 60+ Cure II becomes a bit pointless (I think) and 70+ Cure III is just a minor heal, I'm just glad when there's a WHM that knows how to use Cure V

About those crappy party setups, just reject them off hand. You don't need to put up with them you get plenty of invites (or should do) I leveled from around 60 to 72 without putting up my flag once and from 68 to 70ish my sub was also slightly gimp

Yes...manaburns never give me much skill ups in Enfeeble skill........
I usually got a party with my friend though. And usually I use Cure 3 a lot!
The fact is a RDM usuallt got invite a lot. (At least, I got a /tell for pt almost every time when I log in.) But I usually stay with the pt until disband nomatter how suck it will be. (yea...2 hrs and 3000 exp, the BLM nuked too much and died 3 times with no WHM...great)

[Katina]

Well as a whm idc tbh if they do it. What gets me is if they do it and get hate. I toss regen3 out so much b/c my af body and merit give 24hp a tick.

My method is like Shirai I dont like seeing yellow it annoys me. I just have a healing order of importance. I dont mind ppl doing a cure3 or cure4 after my regen b/c I look at it as better safe than sry.

Only annoys me when I do regen3 and person has like 200 hp missing b/c then u just wasted my 24 hp regen.

[ScarlettPheonix]

Yes I do consider myself a red mage, a very good one as a matter of fact. I also stand by my opinion.

Name me one spell that a smn gets for healing that isn't provided by subbing whm. Not bloodpact, that has limited utility. One spell thats native to summoners. I'll wait.

As healers, Summoners don't have anything that a red mage can't get from subbing whm in a party as well. So yes, in a smn+rdm party I consider myself to be a better healer and the one better suited to being in the main healer role. If they handle the status cures and back up healing I have more then enough time to handle enfeebling and my other duties and they have time to bring out their avatars as well. Being forced into main healing and not having the time or mp to bring out summons is more then a little frusterating for them I know. So everyone wins.^^

There's a time and place for every red mage role, and being more then a support mage or back up healer is neccesary at times. So you're being a diva and turning down all but white mage or summoner as main healer parties makes you a better red mage then me? Sure invites are quick, but you miss out on alot of interesting party set-ups that way. Some of which rake in the exp like mad.

I do main heal when neccessary, if our situation calls for it, just like I enfeeble, magic burst, refresh and haste as neccessary. I'm willing to fufill my role in a party, whatever it is. So yes, I think I can call myself a red mage and a pretty damned good one at that.

[Sugami]

So you're being a diva and turning down all but white mage or summoner as main healer parties makes you a better red mage then me?

Eh putting words into my mouth.

If I wanted to be a healer I would be a WHM (or SMN). Hence my WHM is still lv.1 and I haven't "unlocked" SMN yet (and my Healing Magic is gimped ). If you don't mind draining all your MP into Curing then fine, go for it but that's not for me.

SMN can summon at the start of figths, I've been in parties when they have no trouble summoning in the middle of fights too. What makes SMN good at main healing is their massive MP pool combined with auto-refresh and the odd buffga from their avatars. Cure III is all they get and all they really need considering Cure IV gets uber hate and Cure V is WHM onry uber Cure spell.

[Crispleaf]

Actually...

I have a bit of experience with being a high level white mage and summoner myself And I'm in the 60s with black mage and red mage... so I've seen a few things.

My belief is that red mages should be willing to take more of a healing role in a party that doesn't have a white mage in it, especially as you get closer to 75.

The problem is, if you have a summoner in your party, they can only cast up to cure 3, and they don't have fast cast.

So, if your tank gets seriously hurt, the best the summoner can do is use cure 3 (maybe if the ten minute timer isn't still ticking, they could precede it with Divine Seal). After that cure 3, which might heal about 200hp with a light staff, the summoner either has wait for the recast timer to cool down to use cure 3 again or they could cast cure 2 immediately instead.

As a red mage, not only do you have cure 3, but also cure 4, and you have fast cast. And when a monster is chewing a ninja's limbs off, every moment counts.

Also, once summoners get into their 70s, they have damage dealing attacks that are pretty decent. I think it's probably more efficient, xp-wise, to let the summoner damage deal and backup heal, as needed, and let the red mage deal with curing the tank for the most part.

All that said, there is one situation where a summoner shines at healing above a red mage and that's when several party members are hurt at once while the monster is still alive. Using Leviathan's Spring Water or Carby's Healing Ruby 2 will cure all members of the party quite nicely (at least the ones in range), but the summoner won't get any hate from it. Contrast this with what happens with Curaga spells and you'll see what I mean.

[xaresity]

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[xaresity]

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