MithraPride

Nimonie wrote:

Golddess wrote: But what I'm confused about is, what do you mean by an extra set of laws? I thought they were merely trying to get the current laws clarified.

Golddess there is legislation that has been brought before the US senate/H of R that would make it a hate crime for a preacher to stand up in the pulpit and say homosexuality was a sin. This is an example of an extra law that is wanted.

{Hmmm.}
Question, what does the law say about people who stand up and say "I'm pro-white, all other races are inferior and must be terminated."?
(Given the fact that the KKK exists, the law probably has nothing against someone doing that, but I thought I'd ask anyway.)

Nimonie wrote:As far as the separation of church and state don’t get me started on that. This nation was built on a Christian foundation and pulling that out from under our nation is what is causing us all the problems today.

Personally I think the influence of the church is causing plenty of problems today in our country. And while the founding fathers of this country were Christians, they in fact were very explicit in the separation of the church and the state. Having been driven from a country where the church and state were not separate, they knew through experience that it would be a problem.

Golddess wrote:

Nimonie wrote:

Golddess wrote: But what I'm confused about is, what do you mean by an extra set of laws? I thought they were merely trying to get the current laws clarified.

Golddess there is legislation that has been brought before the US senate/H of R that would make it a hate crime for a preacher to stand up in the pulpit and say homosexuality was a sin. This is an example of an extra law that is wanted.

{Hmmm.}
Question, what does the law say about people who stand up and say "I'm pro-white, all other races are inferior and must be terminated."?
(Given the fact that the KKK exists, the law probably has nothing against someone doing that, but I thought I'd ask anyway.)

I believe the legislation would make it a crime if the preacher used his sermons to incite violence against gays. Just as it is illegal to use speech at a KKK rally to incitve violence against African Americans.

So the legislation would not be an "extra law," it would be a clarification of existing hate speech laws to include homosexuality as a protected group.

Yes it would add sexual orientation to the hate crimes list, but where does hate crime cross the lines of free speech. I mean a pastor standing on the street corner saying homosexuality is a sin and that you need to turn from that sin inorder to be saved could be thought of as a hate crime. for example here are a few links to look at with what can and does happen. http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/10/132004a.asp
http://www.afa.net/clp/ReleaseDetail.asp?id=56
This one turned out ok but still he was arrested over it.
http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/5/172004c.asp

If this kind of stuff is happening now what will be the future if it does get put into hate crimes legislation. I do know there are people that do commit crimes against homosexuals because they are homosexuals but just speaking out against it in public should not be considered a crime.

Hmmm, well when it comes to hate crimes, isn’t that based on race and gender? A person cannot choose their gender or race (they are born like that) but sexual preference is a choice. It's more about speaking out about a life style then it is against a race, isn't it?

Speaking out against BDSM wouldn't be considered a hate crime along those lines since it is a sexual preference. Why should homosexuality be any different?

Yea I aggree with you Prrsha its a choice and shouldnt be added to any hate crime legislation. I was just giveing an example of what is being attempted there have been several attempts to have sexual orientation to the hate crimes legislation.

What are we talking about again?

Fish?

MMMMM FISH

Sorry if I go back to the hate crimes subject, but to me, a hate crime is when someone attacks, or defames someone because of their race, gender, religion, or even sexual orientation. You attack them just because you don't like what they stand for or believe in, doesn't matter whether they choose to be like that or not. A preacher preaching about how homosexuality is wrong is not a hate crime in my eyes; it's just him doing what he believes in, he's not hurting anyone that is gay, he's just speaking up for what he believes in; actually hunting down and beating a homosexual would be a hate crime.

However for the non-choices (race and gender) a person speaking against, say, african-americans can be accused of a hate crime. Hate crimes should be assessed on a case by case basis.

Gays get to speak up for themselves, so what about the people who feel homosexuality is wrong, when they speak up for themselves it's considered a hate crime, speaking up for what you believe in, when you get to choose what that is (ie. religion, sexual preference), is perfectly fine. (My opinion on homosexuality: I don't think is wrong, do whatever you please, just don't go trying to force your beliefs on anyone else. Let people believe in what they want to believe in.)