AGAIN!!!!

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

Sep. 26, 2006 04:00 [PDT] From: FINAL FANTASY XI
About Action Taken Against Third-Party Tool Users (Sep. 26)

Today, a number of accounts which were confirmed to have violated the user agreement by using unauthorized third-party software tools within FINAL FANTASY XI to enable abnormal in-game movement were discovered and have been suspended or permanently terminated.

Based on the results of an investigation, over 3,300 PlayOnline accounts have been either suspended or terminated on Sep. 26, 2006 for the malicious and intentional use of these third-party tools.

We would like to take this time to remind our players that the use of any third-party tools will not only destroy the in-game balance, but will also encourage RMT (real money trading) activities. We will continue to take strict actions against those individuals that we have confirmed to have used such tools.

Please note that some of these third-party tools may cause character information to be altered, erased, or personal information to be leaked to unwanted third parties. If you come across a third-party tool over the Internet, we ask that you please refrain from the download of such a tool, no matter how minor it may appear to be.

To ensure our customers could enjoy the game safely, we will continue to apply measurements to combat these third-party tools and violations.

We thank you for your cooperation and understanding in this matter.

[Tinacat]

{hurray}

[Okuza]

I think a couple things about the bannings are really bad.

1. They always get at least one person that is totally innocent of anything.
2. They have no process at all for reviewing and correcting a ban.

Number 2 is the really scary one. I've read that if you end up banned, that's just the end. They send you a letter saying why, then ignore you.

BTW, POL has stated that they consider "AFK for extended periods without moving to be bot'ing."; So, running a bazaar mule is botting!? One person I read about claims to be a pure PS2 user and has no clue why she's gone except for maybe running a bazaar mule. ; ;

[Shirai]

Hmmm.. strange, I always leave my char to Bazaar or afk when I'm at work or asleep.

Never had any GM trouble, but then again ffxi regularly disconnects me for some weird reason.

On the good side, I believe with the bannings the entire alliance of RMT blms that has monopolyzed nearly every demigod in sky has been banned as far as I could see.
But only time will tell if this is true.
In fact there are armies of new rmt leveling through Kuftal/Boyahda/Valley of sorrows as we speak

[Karou Ariyen]

They can't legally ban players for the "suspicion" of botting if there's no evidance. As much as I love watching RMT banned, they ban innocent players for no god damn reason.

I'm hereby filing a petition of Business Violations against Square-Enix Incorporated to the BBB, in hopes that they will CLEAN UP THEIR ACT

srsly, I can't even bazaar now. if im not constantly moving around, i can be banned. I take offense to that.

[ScarlettPheonix]

I think a couple things about the bannings are really bad.

1. They always get at least one person that is totally innocent of anything.
2. They have no process at all for reviewing and correcting a ban.

Number 2 is the really scary one. I've read that if you end up banned, that's just the end. They send you a letter saying why, then ignore you.

BTW, POL has stated that they consider "AFK for extended periods without moving to be bot'ing."; So, running a bazaar mule is botting!? One person I read about claims to be a pure PS2 user and has no clue why she's gone except for maybe running a bazaar mule. ; ;

Couple of things...

In my experience people who've said they've been banned for no reason were lying more times then not and the few people that I know were actually banned due to a mistake/misconception actually got everything straightened out without any real issues.

Also, I believe the SE reserves the right to ban/deny anyone the right to play FFXI at any time in the TOS.

Post your source please. I've never seen any statements like that ever on the POL site and since as of 10:52pm tonight the AFK Mall in Rolanberry Fields is going strong on Remora, I'm a bit skeptical.

[Pheonixhawk]

you wanna stop RMT SE... THEN SUE THE CRAP OUTTA IGE YOU IDIOTS. Honestly, they should type in buy FFXI gil and then ban them. Friggin amazing. My buddy got kicked for month for suspicion of 3rd party program. Suspicion? Im right there when he plays (he lives in my barracks) he doesnt use third party or buy gil or anything. In fact they should ban IGE and any sites supporting it. That would be the move to make if they were serious. I don't care if they take away FFXI players, Allazkazham or any other site supporitng them. Because they are helping RMT F**k with the game... grrr

[Karou Ariyen]

if they operated in United States Jurisdiction where they could sue for lost income, they would, but they operate outside the USA Where its Legal, so there's nothing SE Can do sadly.

[Okuza]

They can't legally ban players for the "suspicion" of botting if there's no evidance.

I believe the SE reserves the right to ban/deny anyone the right to play FFXI at any time in the TOS

From what I know about legalities here, no, they can't legal ban anyone they please any time they please. Since they're runing a service that entices people to pay to progress -- ie. basically a pyramid scheme where the more you pay the more access you get -- there is an implied contract that they have to keep the service going for you unless you step outside the bounds of those parts of the contract that are indeed legal. Contracts (especially shrink-wrap ones) are messy. They claim TONS of things that they can't legally claim and they do it on purpose to scare off lawsuits.

For instance, the fact that FFXI breaks Windows and stops it from letting you run things like mail and explorer and such by alt-tabbing is also certainly ok for you to fix. It's as if every time you listen to a certain radio station, that station prevents your car from running (because it's not fair to boombox owners who can't drive and listen at the same time). Owners of equipment -- even those that lease things -- can legally modifiy those things to be more suitable for their intended purpose. (IIRC the precedent case here was someone who added seatbelts to a leased truck). Basically, Windower is legal and if they punt you for it, you could sue them.

That's the crux, though. Who in the hell is ever going to file a lawsuit over a video game? Even if someone as rich as Bill Gates played FFXI and he got pissed over being banned, he'd probably just play something else. It's not worth fighting and if you're not among the idle rich, you can't afford to fight it.

So, while it's definitely not legal for them to do so, for all practical purposes SE really can ban pretty much as they please.

--

srsly, I can't even bazaar now. if im not constantly moving around, i can be banned. I take offense to that.

This was speculation in a thread on BG. One person posted she couldn't figure out why banned. Another person posted a quote from SE about "not moving = botting" (which I find utterly ridiculous, but it could be true). The original poster then jumps around saying "omg, that's it, I bazaar all the time, etc." It's almost certainly not true about bazaar-afk being bannable. I can't really see SE anouncing that afk is banable, but I could see some GM saying that. GMs say a lot of dumb things that aren't true.

--

3. SE now has a task force who's ONLY goal is to ban people.

Just read this from a translated announcement from SE. This one is really scary. What do they do when they can't meet their quota? I know GMs. They're the bottom of the food chain -- kicked around by their own employers and by the customers. They're ignorant and underpaid and often spiteful. THIS is what will be banning people and for which there is no recovery?

GMs have recently taken to suspending people that are even in the same alliance as someone that runs a cheat. So, for example, let's say you go to do Fafnir with your friend's HNM shell. They run a claim-bot to grab Fluffy. GM catches bot. Bans botter, suspends everyone else. Now you have a "botter" marker on your account. Who do you think the "Banning strike force" will pick to ban when they're under quota and need some quick numbers!?

This is one of the big reasons why I don't do HNM stuff. I don't want to be part of stuff where you pretty much have to cheat just to play the game or be assisted by those who cheat. That and the fact that 60 people standing around mashing on provoke/stun/dia macros (if they're not cheating) for hours on end is just about the least fun thing I can imagine.

Why don't they FIX THE GAME instead? Instance all the CB'd stuff. Get rid of nice drops off rare-spawn NMs -- move 'em all to BCs so people can schedule their game instead of letting the game schedule them. Do something -- anything! -- to make it so there's just no incentive to claim-bot or warp-hack. Starting a war with hackers and RMT does nothing but create free advertising for the hackers/RMT'ers.

Gawd, they're JP! Haven't they read Sun Tzu or Musashi!? Don't let your enemy pick the damn battlefield!

[Karou Ariyen]

>>Deleted<<

[Karou Ariyen]

This isnt a law suit against a video game. The Customer Support Team according to BBB includes SE's Taskforce, which meansi f the quality they provide isnt up to par, its a violation, Besides, If they wanna rid gilsellers then BAN US ALL remember the banning of weapons on an airline? The only safe airline is an empty airline, so is SE saying that we're all automatically gilsellers and botters? Becuase if they are, they dont treat their customers very well.

And as for speculation, uhm, where was that posted, I dont go to any FFXI Boards outside of MP, cuz this site is the only one with credible information IMO.

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

US intelectual property laws make RMT against RL law. No need to sue, just bust the {Bastard Swords}.

BUT these people are incorperated in other countries.

Microsquish and the US government spent YEARS getting China to agree to crack down on software pirates, and to this date that is all thay have done, agreed. I saw an estimate about 6 months ago that said 60% of the software used by the Chinese govenerment is pirated.

Karu, the BBB is toothless. With tender gums. On top of that, no one ever calls the BBB to say something went right. They have NO positve lists at all. It is a great orginazation for putting local ***** out of busness, but for an international corperation? NFW.

One person I read about claims to be a pure PS2 user and has no clue why she's gone except for maybe running a bazaar mule.

Ummmm.... If you believe everything you read, please turn in your voting card. If this person IS a PS2 player, calling customer service can work wonders. Or not. If they banned Bazaar mules, 3/4 of us would be banned, and the rest of us would not play.

[Karou Ariyen]

SOrry for the double Post all, I was trying to fix it but Tsybil stopped it ^^: If anyone could delete the one ontop of the post above Tsybils on this page, with my name on it I'd appreciate it

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

You can edit it to a blank Karu.

[Karou Ariyen]

Thanks Tsybill I didnt Think Of That ^^;

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

Silly kitty

/hugs

[Sugami]

US intelectual property laws make RMT against RL law. No need to sue, just bust the {Bastard Swords}.

Umm... no it doesn't. I've posted about this before, I asked the lecturer on computer law at my university and technically the "intellectual property" is the game code only, the imaginary money is just a product of that.
It's like people buying a collectable card game; what do you do with the ones you don't want? Give them away, sell them, trade them or throw them away... they're you're property, you bought them you can do what you please with them. However if you started marketing the same thing then that would be stealing intellectual property.

IGE is doing nothing against the law besides breach of contract and that's only if the owners of the site have accounts on FFXI.

As for standing still/AFKing == botting, that's only if you're fishing, mining etc. If they suspect someone of fishbotting they'll send tells to the person and if they don't respond they'll take it as if they're botting and suspend/ban the account.

[Keavy]

On the fishbotting: I am sick and tired of people sending me /tells as they pass by.

Now whenever I get one of these /tells I respond with "Can't talk now, botfishing." Most get mad at me or get a laugh.

[ScarlettPheonix]

From what I know about legalities here, no, they can't legal ban anyone they please any time they please. Since they're runing a service that entices people to pay to progress -- ie. basically a pyramid scheme where the more you pay the more access you get -- there is an implied contract that they have to keep the service going for you unless you step outside the bounds of those parts of the contract that are indeed legal. Contracts (especially shrink-wrap ones) are messy. They claim TONS of things that they can't legally claim and they do it on purpose to scare off lawsuits.

For instance, the fact that FFXI breaks Windows and stops it from letting you run things like mail and explorer and such by alt-tabbing is also certainly ok for you to fix.

I apologize for the late reply, had to go dig up my references. Just as a restaurant owner or a club owner has the right to turn away diners or would be clubbers, SE does have the right deny the game and Playonline services to anyone.

SE's Rules and Policies can be found here

From the Playonline User's Agreement:

4.4 Revocation of User Rights.
SEI shall reserve the right in its sole discretion to revoke or suspend your PlayOnline user account and your ability to use PlayOnline at any time without prior notice to you, particularly but not limited to if SEI should determine (in its sole discretion) or should reasonably believe that you are responsible for, or have participated in, any of the following (collectively, "Prohibited Activities"):

Could someone sue them for denying them use of the game? Sure. I really doubt they'd win and the legal battle would take ages before it reached a conclusion either in court or as a settlement however.

And please, if you're going to use Windower, come up with a better reason then "the Alt+Tab function is broken."

Alt+ Tab works- its not disabled or doesn't not work when you hit both keys. Something does happen just not in the way you think it should. FFXI is designed to play in full screen mode and simply shuts down when Alt+Tab is pressed instead of going into a "windowed" format. SE chose to design/modify FFXI for PC this way and they have every right to keep it that way.

Honestly, if you disagree with SE's policies and how they designed thier game so much why are you playing?


On a different note, I found this while rereading the Rules of Conduct today.

From the FFXI Rules of Conduct:

Please note that you may still make use of Final Fantasy XI features that have been provided for the convenience of the player. For example, the use of autorun while locked onto a target is not considered to be a prohibited act. Stepping away from gameplay during bazaar is also an acceptable act.

[Okuza]

If you believe everything you read, please turn in your voting card. If this person IS a PS2 player, calling customer service can work wonders.

They sounded as credible as anyone on the 'net sounds. Said she called it in and got a reply that was basically, "Sorry, nothing we can do. You have to wait for the ban letter." The speculation in the other thread was that she probably gave her account info to someone that used hacks while on her account. She sounded pretty naive.

SE is just plain dumb. They've decided to fight a war with RMT inside the game itself when instead they could just make a few tiny changes and make it so there's no way for RMT to pick a fight.

Really simple stuff like -- give contested NMs a static spawn location and have them spawn already claimed by a random player within a certain radius or that has touched it's ??? marker and is still in range of the ??? mark. Voila! Suddenly the entire concept of a claim-bot is pointless.

Add assertion checks for movement server side. Every time someone moves too quick, warp them to jail. Oh no! Warp and flee hacks now won't work and the player has to petition a GM to play again -- ie. GMs can take their own sweet time and focus on real customers first.

Instancing stuff would help a ton (like dynamis especially), but would take some more work. Those two up there are like 1H of coding and maybe a week of test. Much less money, time, and effort than an "RMT ban taskforce" and they fix all the major whines about RMT.

All the RMT is a bad sign. RMT demand goes wild when people think an MMORPG is dying out or they might quit. "Gotta get that last HQ/+1 item before I go! Must finish relic weapon!" followed by "Must sell character to recover the $RL$ I spent on gil before quiting." ><

[Pheonixhawk]

What about making gil non-tradable... Wouldnt that help any? True there would still be an issue about camping mobs for rare items. Buuuut. Now Once gil Sellers got the super rare items, and made the cash what would they do with it? Nothing. All they can do is use it to actually play the game they obviously don't care about.. On the offhand, when your broke and low on gil, you can borrow from other players. But is that really so bad... What is bad though, is if you get a item that isnt rare / ex, but you cant put it on the AH, you can't sell it.. ever. Another downfall.


Then I though, well maybe they could just make NM mobs random spawn. and I mean RANDOM. Like spawn after 3 secs, then 30 mins, then 4hours, then 50 secs. etc. And make sure it could be anywhere. Even if its the friggin zone entrance. As long as it doesnt ever pop in the same place. That would make it 10X harder to get the NM yes, but it would at least make RMT sweat for it.

Alas there is no true way to stop RMT. It will always go on. Nomatter what, in ever MMORGP. Because people don't have jobs or lives, and need money and feel they can earn thier living through playing Video Games. Whats sad is they don't even care about the players themselves either. Who cares if we screw the economy. I just want my cash.

[Sugami]

Really simple stuff like -- give contested NMs a static spawn location and have them spawn already claimed by a random player within a certain radius or that has touched it's ??? marker and is still in range of the ??? mark. Voila! Suddenly the entire concept of a claim-bot is pointless.

SE would argue that takes the skill out of it

Not RMT but just as annoying are guildshop campers. People who can't earn money like everyone else they have to camp and NPC to steal all of one item then sell it on again at the AH. Why the hell haven't they done anything about this? All they need to do is give the guild shops an unlimited supply or put a tag on bought items so they can't be resold or even traded on.

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

They sounded as credible as anyone on the 'net sounds.

Instancing stuff would help a ton (like dynamis especially), but would take some more work.

We are getting there. Assualt is instanced. It isn't the time spent in coding, it is the development and testing time to change an existing system I think.

Then I though, well maybe they could just make NM mobs random spawn. and I mean RANDOM. Like spawn after 3 secs, then 30 mins, then 4hours, then 50 secs.

They did this with JEJ and LL. Between the random timer and his horrid drop rate, Jack is no longer overcampped. But even with the random timer fo Lizzy, they had to introduce the R/E Bounding Boots. You can still see Lizzy campers anytime you are in her spawning area.

[Okuza]

SE chose to design/modify FFXI for PC this way and they have every right to keep it that way.

Sure they can keep FFXI that way. But the thing is -- you have the right to modify your PC so that it's behavior can't be modified in ways you don't like. And, SE can't claim your changes to your PC&OS invalidates the implied "contract" of the TOS agreement.

Now, when you start interfering with the servers (warp/flee hack, claim hack, etc.) or using a modified client, then they have some serious legal legs to stand on. But, windower and a lot of other stuff don't alter FFXI in the slightest. They only alter windows (specifically, the run time system & library calls). Legally, SE can't touch windower or job-assist or map-display users. They can't really even touch a botter that is sitting at the keyboard -- say a fishbotter with totally automatted fishing that is chatting away to friends and shell or a claim-botter that uses an input-assist program to claim faster -- a lot of bots do more than that (like generating their own packets) and those definitely fail wrt. to the TOS.

The restaurant owner analogy is incomplete, too. If the owner had a series of restaurants where you have to "level up" and eat at each one of his lower-quality shops before you can go the best one, then the analogy is more complete. If after you finally get to the culinary pinacle he suddenly says "sorry, you have to start all over" for some random reason, he WILL loose the lawsuit unless the reason is damn good and he'll probably need to refund all the money that customer spent at his lower shops, too -- especially if the reason the customer got kicked was something he was doing all along and which the owner obviously would observe from the start.

Anyway, legal issues are mostly moot -- almost no one will bother to go through the trouble of actually insisting on their rights. That costs.

--

The problem with making NMs harder to claim is that just provides even more incentive for people to use warp hacks and claim-assist hacks. Hell, when I saw this one person instantly jump across the entire room to Mee Degi and claim it -- I just gave up. That was just too much. Called a GM "Thanks for the tip, I'll watch her." But I never saw the player vanish from game. I stopped paying attention after a while. I don't want to stare at /sea lists and stay mad for hours.

There is nothing any honest player can do about things like that. The GMs don't do anything when you call them. You either give up on the item or you buy gil and then buy the item (from the RMT who then sells the gil again). Or, you get really mad and decide to cheat yourself just to compete with the RMT. I gave up on the item.

Claim-racing is not skill. It's a test of who cheats and who doesn't. If you don't cheat, you might as well not bother in most cases. This is why I rarely camp H/NM. It's not worth my time trying to out-claim the bots and .dat hackers. Making claiming "harder" is just playing to the bot crowd. It doesn't need to be harder. It needs to be fairer. Make the fight harder if you want to test skill, not the claim. ><

Not RMT but just as annoying are guildshop campers.

Are you sure they're not RMT? Guildcamping is one of the very easiest things around to bot. Level 1 character can do it. The character is utterly disposable. If banned, you're back in business in 30m with a new account. All the locations are 100% static. As long as their stuff is on AH, they can just sit at the vendor and keep mining it to keep prices high and force folks onto AH.

IF I was RMT, that's what I'd do. I'd buy up characters, sell off gear and do guild vendor mining and crafting. Claimbots and warphacks are waaaay too visible and easy for SE to notice and ban. I could have a whole farm of PCs with bots on each one. If I was dedicated, I could watch over them all and respond in chat to any GM querry. IMHO, that's exactly what the smart RMT are doing.

The ones you see pissing everyone off by CB'ing things like Kirin, Ulili, KB, etc. are probably kids out to earn cash for a car while playing the game. I bet the real RMT-pros are heavy into botting for fish, vendors, & crafts.

[Sugami]

But the thing is -- you have the right to modify your PC so that it's behavior can't be modified in ways you don't like. And, SE can't claim your changes to your PC&OS invalidates the implied "contract" of the TOS agreement.

Any 3rd party program violates their TOS or whatever. This constitutes anything running in the background that interracts or interfers with FFXI

The restaurant owner analogy is incomplete, too. If the owner had a series of restaurants where you have to "level up" and eat at each one of his lower-quality shops before you can go the best one, then the analogy is more complete.

I disagree and think the restaurant anaology fits. Leveling up, obtaining items etc. is all a product of the service they're providing. Can argue that getting full is the product at eating at a resturant in the same sense that leveling etc. is the product of the game.

The problem with making NMs harder to claim is that just provides even more incentive for people to use warp hacks and claim-assist hacks. Hell, when I saw this one person instantly jump across the entire room to Mee Degi and claim it -- I just gave up. That was just too much. Called a GM "Thanks for the tip, I'll watch her." But I never saw the player vanish from game. I stopped paying attention after a while. I don't want to stare at /sea lists and stay mad for hours.

I don't camp NMs for this reason, too many RMTs and hackers are after it it's just a waste of time. Even if I somehow manage to get claim I have the worst luck with drop rate too

Are you sure they're not RMT? Guildcamping is one of the very easiest things around to bot. Level 1 character can do it. The character is utterly disposable. If banned, you're back in business in 30m with a new account. All the locations are 100% static. As long as their stuff is on AH, they can just sit at the vendor and keep mining it to keep prices high and force folks onto AH.

I assume they're not RMT as the profit is quite small and it's over a long stretch of time too. 15K for bronze ingots, you'll get one stack every game day (except for guild holiday), just doesn't seem worth it if that's their sole source of income.

[Alya Mizar (Tsybil)]

Ray of hope dept.

Many of the Guild campers have moved onto bigger and better things. Last night, about 16:00 game time, I bought three stacks of Bronze Ingots from the Bastok Smithing Guild shop. Seeing as they get one stack a day, that's three game days without anyone else shopping there at all.

Bone Chips in Winurst seem to not be campped at all anymore, and sometimes you can even buy Silk Thread in Windurst too.

Just don't try to buy Womura Coocoons in Al Zabi.

[Sugami]

I managed to nab 4 wamoura cocoons over a week or so for my Mezraq and COR AF

I've got 2 stacks of Bronze Ingots before, might have been from the shop in Al Zabi though ^^

[Tinacat]

My cloth guild isnt camped at all, so I am able to camp it, and get all the wam cocoons I want, which I use for skill up, not for selling. (they go for about 4-5k on AH)

[Okuza]

Any 3rd party program violates their TOS or whatever. This constitutes anything running in the background that interracts or interfers with FFXI

LOL. This is so not true. All of windows is in literal fact a 3rd party program. The verb interferes is grossly inacurate, too. For input/output, where do you draw the line? Device drivers are just programs, too. Most also have application level code running in the background. They are 3rd party applications and they most definitely interfere with FFXI. Can't use those?

An OS is a just a collection of programs. The concept of fair use legally nullifies that portion of a contract that tries to prevent you from using things you buy or lease in the expected manner for which they are normally used. Car leases, for instance, can't force you to use only gasoline from the lessor's shops. Windows programs can't force you to use only applications that the seller prefers or to prevent you from configuring windows in the manner in which you prefer or from running multiple applications simultaneously. The entire purpose of windows is to do multiple things simultaneously.

Also, their use of "3rd party" is a problem, too, though mostly just for them. They're saying the customer can do anything he pleases if he writes the code himself. He's 2nd party (or 1st depending on POV). This would go for the PS2, also. He could code changes for that according to the "no 3rd party" thing, though there he wouldn't be protected by fair use -- ps2 expects to be running only a single app at a time. Before they can win on a non-server effecting issue, they'd have to prove that he was using something he didn't write as well as argue that fair-use doesn't apply. Big can of worms for them there. If they can prove it, uh, how did they get the data? They don't have the legal right to search his computer and seize data on it. How do they know he didn't write it himself?

Legally, they're up the creek without a paddle if they target stuff like windower and the various input/output assist programs. Practically, though, they can get away with whatever they want limitted only by their own desire for profit. Alienate enough people and their game will spiral down and die. That's why they're only going after the ones they really can win in both court and public opinion -- speed, warp, bot, etc. (stuff that alters the server). If it doesn't have a server-side effect, they're balancing class action legal risks and business loss risks against the tiny practical risk that one of their victims will care enough to stand up and sue them.

I assume they're not RMT as the profit is quite small and it's over a long stretch of time too. 15K for bronze ingots, you'll get one stack every game day

The thing about vendor mining is that it's has zero overhead. When you combine it with a craft mule (that you're more careful not to be caught botting), you can drive out competition on a ton of items. Also, there are a number of vendor items that can be mined for big profit per item on straight resale. Uh, I'll pass on an explicit list of those -- I check 'em myself when I'm nearby. Almost never get 'em, but it's nice when I do.

Crafting commodities is nice steady income. It won't get you rich if you play the game directly, but if you had servants play multiple characters 24x7 that would be a very different prospect. Especially if the servants are free and have lightning fast reflexes and perfect timing to ensure they always obtains materiel at the cheapest price. Hundreds of millions of gil per day go towards commodities (tools, food, meds). Let's say you can snag 5% of that as profit with bots. That's 5m per day for doing nothing at all. I think 5% is pretty conservative, too. I suspect a good bot team could do more like 30% (30m per day).

Unlike fishbots and claimbots, they'd be very hard to catch, too. ><

[Sugami]

Well when it comes down to it SE's word is law and if they say Windower is a 3rd party program that violates the TOS then it is, you can't argue with them they are God on this matter.