The things I do for gil.

Neoshinobi · Post by **Neoshinobi** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 6:32 am

I've yet to get money just shot my way....although I've shot money out to other people...

Aony · Post by **Aony** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:09 pm

Lihera wrote:Sorry about that, 'caught me in a bit of a bad mood at the time. Gotta lay offa dat catnip.

No! NOOOOO!!! The catnip is my friend! Dont leave it alone it needs company...

Post by **Alya Mizar (Tsybil)** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:48 pm

Ummm... I garden.

I feel so mundane herrre sometimes.

Kahvi · Post by **Kahvi** » Sat Mar 05, 2005 9:44 pm

When i first started playing and needed gil desparately for spells.. i would moonlight as a dancer in bastok... >.>

Fayin · Post by **Fayin** » Sun Mar 06, 2005 6:39 am

Tivia wrote:I created a script a while back which was basically just a very long version of a ingame macro for some taru. He wanted it in a particular order and delays to use particular motions. I did not think much of it until I saw it in action..He really thought the particular timings and moves out because it was pretty amazing the dance he did. It came Darn Darn close to similating some of the traditional japanese fan dances..he of course had me set it to use a fan every so often. He ran it for hours and hour during the new years events, I must admit it was very entertaining to watch.

That's awesome Tiv! Did you happen to Fraps capture a video clip of some of it by chance?

Post by **Karou Ariyen** » Sun Mar 06, 2005 10:47 am

I've had various other ways too, one i've told you about my 60k sword set, that was a gift from my big brother, as well as 14k for buying him a stack of rolaberry pies. but let me tell you about last night......

Savage RSE, Aspire Knife, Razor Axe, scarlet ribbon, wing pendant, and sandy ring. i sold massive stacks of items in my bazaar some tarutaru bought all of (5k) he did this /t Karou I know Ninja can be expensive, so you pretty Kitty, Let me help you out =)

he cleaned me out!

moral of the story? Ninja's whether nin/ or /nin ALWAYS get pity~

Neoshinobi · Post by **Neoshinobi** » Sun Mar 06, 2005 1:20 pm

I've lost 120k from being scammed out of a casino...

All aboard the pity train!

Kopopo · Post by **Kopopo** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 12:15 am

Stupid casinos. I say if you lost money on that because of a scam then you deserve it.

Lihera · Post by **Lihera** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 1:18 am

On the bright side, the biggest casino on Gilgamesh just lost 10millon gil, yay!

Post by **Tivia** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 2:52 pm

No I did not fraps it, in hindsight I wish I had it was amazing to see. Especially considering I have no idea what I did with the copy of the script I saved on my machine.

As to casino's

Casino operators run when they see me coming, I own loaded die and have broke more then one.

I cannot explain it honestly, I just have a system I use, used it in EQ and in FFXI..my win ratio is far greater then my loss ration.

On the downside once you have cleaned most of em out to the tune of 20+mil each, they start refusing service..

Sucks considering I find that more fun then crafting as of late.

Post by **Shirai** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 3:06 pm

Lihera wrote:On the bright side, the biggest casino on Gilgamesh just lost 10millon gil, yay!

Casino's,

Only one spot for me...
/blist add
I hate gambling! (Family thing)

Anyway,
My way to make fast gil.
Taxi,
Teleport advert in Jueno gives me about 10 to 30k Gil an hour,
even more on special requests.

Crispleaf · Post by **Crispleaf** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:17 pm

For white mage teleports, it all depends on how much competition I have. When I'm the only one offering teleports, the money rolls in tremendously. But in minutes, that can all change. I went from getting 20K in one hour to just 4K the next because suddenly four more white mages were competing with me.

Plus, you have to pick busy times of the day to really get a steady stream of customers.

It's really not an exact science

Considering the cost of the teleport scrolls (probably around 300k for the set of 6... even if you quested them, you could have chosen to sell them all the same...) it'll take a few evenings to cover the money you could have had. (Try not to think about it too much

)

Maezen · Post by **Maezen** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:39 pm

Teleports are ok at best...I like to have a variety of methods for making my gil...and I kinda hate teleporting it was a bit too boring for me and I could keep a conversation going with all the zoning i was doing

so now i'll only teleport friends and anyone willing to pay 1k for a ride....did i mention i only offer a price of 1k when someone sends me a /tell for it?

Crispleaf · Post by **Crispleaf** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 7:20 pm

That reminds me of a recent incident.

I was running through Windurst Walls on official Windurst business, just about to zone into Windurst Waters when I get a tell requesting a Teleport-Holla for 500 gil.

Now, I'm not much of a businessmithra, but I briefly thought of the inconvenience of setting my home point in Windurst away from Jeuno, let alone running across to the other side of the Walls (I guessed that the person was probably by the auction house... that's usually the place people get inspied to teleport for some reason).

But I remembered what Mae said about never accepting a teleport for less than a thousand... and Holla was a really long way from Windurst, so it was certainly still a bargain... so I replied, "Offer me 1000 and we have a deal."

Then he said (assuming it was a he... his name seemed guy-like), "But I only have 500." (Yeah, I thought to myself, and what were you going to pay the chocobo vendor?

)

"So I guess that's it, then," I said, thinking it would be the end of it, and continued into Windurst Waters.

But, of course, I get the voice of desperation in response, "Pleeeeeeaasee!"

I swear, more than anyone, white mages usually get that reply when they've said no

Post by **Tivia** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 7:31 pm

I am exactlly the same. After playing a wizard in EQ for 5 years and being turned from the master of damage to Translocate Bi#@!, I came to resent teleportation. So as a result with my whm, I do not tele for less then 1k. The way I see it, its my inconvience as I do not really feel like doing it, and I am still 9 times out of 10 cheaper then a choco.

Its a win win for me as far as I am concerned. Either they do not want to pay that much for the Tele, relieving me of something i hate doing, or they pay me and make it worth my while.

as for the cost of the spells..yeesh, I got mine about 6 months ago when I was activly playing and doing the quest it took me less then a day to complete them all except for Teleport ....whatever the Glacier area one is, I cant remember atm.

Maezen · Post by **Maezen** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 8:10 pm

Tivia has it exactly right...or at least how i feel...haha i actually had to explain that it was a convience to someone that asked me for one...he /telled me a request, so i asked 1k from him for it (as i do for ANYONE that asks me for it)...and he had the nerve to try to chew me out for overcharging. I told him if he didn't like my price to find someone else, he said something along the lines of me having some nerve for trying to screw him out of his gil (he was a whm too) so i reitterated that it was a convenience and that I had other business to attend, then asked if he still wanted it. Needless to say...i didn't hear from him again

Josiejo · Post by **Josiejo** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 8:47 pm

Tivia, chocobos, especially in towns (excluding Jeuno) are gonna be less than 1k. In fact, even Jeuno Chocobos lately have been far less than 1k, so I'd say you're more like 1 time out of 10 cheaper than a Chocobo. And really, crag Chocobos are the expensive ones, so it's really compounding their expenses just to start riding closer to their destination. Some people are pretty well of and don't mind paying it... others aren't so lucky and it hurts to pay it, but if it's the convenience they're looking for, I guess they will. Me, I'd just get a Chocobo.

And shame on anyone who won't teleport for less than 1k. Unless you're in dire need of keeping your Home Point away from the town you happen to be in, then you're getting paid to inconvenience yourself. Some people don't get that luxury... many get inconvenienced without payment, and sometimes minus exp. And if someone can track you down and identify you as a WHM enough to be able to send you a tell asking for one, then I think that deserves some merit. You can /anon and change eq if you're that worried about becoming a teleport bitch.

What I guess I mean to say is that it seems the essence of a White Mage is being lost to profit and secrecy. Yes, I know at times it can be a heavy burden, can get annoying, and you just don't want to deal with it. But forming such a hard default response to someone asking for help from a White Mage doesn't seem to me like it's in the spirit the class is intended for.

Ephi · Post by **Ephi** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 8:47 pm

im not a WHM at all so i cant tele an i understand the inconvenience to the WHM... so i give decent rewards for a poor kitty... but i dont shout that i have decent rewards... i may say Reward pending... an when/if i get tele... i reward them... ive shouted i was poor an then after i get tele i shout that person just got 8k for tele... then i mt'd 1 of the WHMs i tell'd asked for tele and got Blisted... i meant to tell to another kitty of MP... i said "i got tele"... anyway... one time i gave 500 and 2 items(i believe 1 was a crab shell... cant remember the other) an another time... just last night actually i rewarded 3 silk threads i had... sadly that was all i really had

(meaning if i had the gil id of payed that) but anyway... ya thats how i treat WHMs that help
an i dont shout what i gave the person now...
also that WHM that Blisted me was rude anyway... it didnt even respond when i 1st asked... coulda at least said "sorry im busy synthing" which was what it was doin at the time...

Crispleaf · Post by **Crispleaf** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:15 pm

[quote="Josiejo"]And shame on anyone who won't teleport for less than 1k.[quote]

Don't misunderstand, Jo. If I'm in the mood for setting up shop and selling teleports, I'm virtually forced to offer them for less than one thousand gil (at least to common locations), or no one would buy one

I'm talking about times where I'm minding my own business, probably even anonymous, when someone sees me run by in white mage AF and tells me for a teleport despite my obvious do-not-disturb demeanor.

I'm usually in the middle of something else, so yes, it had better be worth my while to interupt my otherwise peaceful day for such a request

Sigyn · Post by **Sigyn** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:24 pm

heh.... Don't let Goldy know you're charging for Teleports...

You haven't seen her Teleport Macro.

Josiejo · Post by **Josiejo** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 9:51 pm

Crispleaf wrote:I'm talking about times where I'm minding my own business, probably even anonymous, when someone sees me run by in white mage AF and tells me for a teleport despite my obvious do-not-disturb demeanor.

I'm usually in the middle of something else, so yes, it had better be worth my while to interupt my otherwise peaceful day for such a request

Well, then just say you're too busy. Why consider it? You don't want to be disturbed, right? Or is it that "hey, they already asked you, might as well milk it"? Like I said before, if they can identify you as a White Mage, then you've already opened the door for those kinds of questions. Kinda sucks, I know... WHM AF is cool! But you can always turn them down..

Crispleaf · Post by **Crispleaf** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:06 pm

Well, as I said, I'm not a very good businessmithra

You're right, I could just turn them down, and quite often, I end up doing that.

Still, there are times, if the person asking is really desperate, that if they offer enough incentive, that I'd be silly to pass up their request

It's all up to what the person asking is willing to pay. If they don't like the price I offer, they don't have to accept it

There are plenty of other white mages out there, for one thing. And there's instant warp scrolls, chocobos, airships, outpost teleports, warp 2s, expedition force scrolls, teleport rings, among other things, to get around with.

Post by **Tivia** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:12 pm

You misread my meaning josie,

If I am offering Tele services, I expect to get the same amount as anyone else.

However If I am not offering said services and someone tells me asking for one, then they should expect to pay more since they are bothering me with their need, not my need.

A whm should expect less if they are offering the service in shouts and whatnot, obviously the whm needs the money and they are offering their service for it. However when they are not offering said service, then you get my point?

As for me, 500 gil is utterly insignificant, heck for that matter 1k is insiginificant to me. I do not need money for a tele to be honest, I have more gil then I could possibly spend anytime in the near future. However if someone wants a Teleport from me, they are asking something I am normally unwilling to offer ordinarly, thus I expect them to offer me an amount that suggest's that they understand I am not offering my services, but they are Requesting my services when I am not otherwise offering.

Besides, catch someone desperate enough and you will be amazed at what they will pay. Max I have ever recieved for a Tele, 10k.

Josiejo · Post by **Josiejo** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 10:45 pm

Ook... all of those things will come back to haunt you guys. More White Mages? Sure, and if someone told that to you, I'm sure you'd feel a bit frustrated, and certainly not looking forward to looking for the next busy and jaded White Mage to help you.

And again, if someone sends you a tell asking for a teleport, no, you're not under any obligation to oblige. But, you are the one who made it somehow obvious that you are a White Mage, and that at least deserves a thump on the noggin, if not the help your job can provide. It's not as if people don't realize it's an inconvenience... most people who actually /search for a White Mage 37- do realize what that person would have to do to fulfill their request, which is the reason most would put a gil reward amount in the /tell. It puts people in an awkward position to have to ask a stranger for a favor where there is no real reason to do it other than what they can offer. If they're forced to offer something else, then they often remember that the next time, say, said WHM is now a dead THF somewhere needing a Raise.

/point THF
/laugh THF
/goodbye THF

It's not as if every White Mage hard up on gil is spamming the shout channel for teleportation services. Sometimes you have to find one. Apparently, now one would be lucky to find one who will do it out of some form of kindness.

Crispleaf · Post by **Crispleaf** » Mon Mar 07, 2005 11:48 pm

Jojo, you should be able to understand that you cannot be 100% charitable all the time.

As a warrior, I'm sure you've experienced the time where, while in a party of strangers, you get attacked by multiple enemies, or maybe just one that's too tough for your party to beat. Now you perform the selfless act of heroism, provoke the beast or beasts, and run it away from your party so they can make it to safety.

You end up dying, but your party makes it alive. But you don't mind. After all, it's your "job." The guide says you should do this. Your party will regard you as a hero, and life will be better...

And for your selfless act, you would think that at the very least your party would try to even look for a raise... but instead, they all go, "Well... gotta go... my toes are cold... {Disbanding Party.}" And leave you for dead.

I know this has happened to you. It's happened to me many, many times as a Palain, a Warrior, and a Ninja (although, thanks to Mijun Gakure... it's not so bad as a Ninja

).

I still do what I'm supposed to do, and I still get my feelings hurt on occasion when I'm abandoned thanklessly for doing the right thing.

So, how does this relate to white mages?

While a tank's call-to-action comes up from time-to-time in a dangerous area, white mages are constantly bombarded with requests from everyone looking for a handout.

Can I get a raise? Can you power-level me? Can I get a teleport? Can I get a Protectra 4 before I go into this BCNM? Can I get a Poisona before I fall over and die?

Everyday when I play as a white mage, and I'm not anonymous, I am continuously bombarded for selfless acts. Some people will offer meager amounts of money, but they'd all take my help for free if they could. And usually, I'm pretty generous, I think.

But I get taken advantage of all the time as a white mage.

The other day I left my party and risked my life sneaking across Boyhada Tree to the very depths, past any number of monsters that could finish me in two hits, to give Raise 2s to an entire party of high level characters (annihilated by a couple of flies), who offered only thanks in return for my actions, despite the great risk I took.

Not only that, but the person who asked me had, in a previous party a long time ago, used an instant warp scroll when he was the main healer and had full MP, and left us for dead when we got a link in the Crawler's Nest.

And still, I came all the way through the valley of death to save him. Not because I'm a great person, but because it's the right thing to do, and I feel better doing that.

There just comes a point where you have to limit your exposure to the madness and say no. I could spend all day every day putting out as many fires as I can and it wouldn't be enough. That's not why I want to play the game. I like to help, but it's not always fun.

So, if I get a /tell asking for a teleport, and I'm not actively offering them, and especially if I'm anonymous at the time, you'd have to expect you caught me at a bad time. If I want extra compensation for it, it's only because anyone else would do the same... If you wanted a plumber to go to your house in the middle of the night in an emergency, you won't get that kind of service cheap.

Neoshinobi · Post by **Neoshinobi** » Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:11 am

People constantly look for White Mage handouts because thats what you are, a support job, your job is to support the team.

Crispleaf wrote:You end up dying, but your party makes it alive. But you don't mind. After all, it's your "job." The guide says you should do this. Your party will regard you as a hero, and life will be better...

And for your selfless act, you would think that at the very least your party would try to even look for a raise... but instead, they all go, "Well... gotta go... my toes are cold... {Disbanding Party.}" And leave you for dead.

Yep, life sure is better after that

Why I do believe the 'guide' even says its a white mages job to support with aforementioned spells.

Why the 'guide' even mentions lotting as something everybody does...just where are you getting this information from?

Crispleaf wrote:While a tank's call-to-action comes up from time-to-time in a dangerous area, white mages are constantly bombarded with requests from everyone looking for a handout.

If its a warriors job is to "take one for the team" then its also a White Mages job to cast all the spells they can to make sure it stays like that, then again half those spells you have are something meant for other party members, you didn't get raise spells for yourself now did you? What about teleport spells? Did you really go through all the trouble and time just to use them for yourself?

Crispleaf wrote:If you wanted a plumber to go to your house in the middle of the night in an emergency, you won't get that kind of service cheap

Well from what you said earlier you give handouts half the time, even when your busy, as you said giving a raise 2 to a whole party including a person you partied with before who was an ass for free, then wouldn't you give out a teleport for free?

Theres a difference between a plumber and your, for one your going the pay the plumber no matter what time he/she comes out....everytime...Now as from what you said you usually give out handouts, plumbers don't...the whole idea you put up of giving out handouts 24/7 as much as you can handle...then suddenly saying "oh a teleport, that'll cost you, ya know even tho i just got through helping half the server for free with nothing to show for it other than a 'thank you now go away'."

Josiejo · Post by **Josiejo** » Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:14 am

I guess you're right C-leaf. I know it's not fun being a teletaxi sometimes, and even moreso when you're not trying to be one. And I know part of the fun in getting Artifact gear is being able to wear it, even if it's a red flag to everyone that you're a White Mage.

It's just that there have been times for me where I haven't been able to receive any teleportation help when being as unasserting as possible (by shouting that I needed a Teleport, had reward amount, {Excuse me...} {Please forgive me.}, whatever). It just doesn't help sometimes, so there's only the choice of hoofing it or tracking down a White Mage. When you're in that position, you wonder how so many of them could just ignore you, some even just sitting down not doing anything, and wonder if you'd ever do the same thing if the roles were reversed. Oh well...

Crispleaf · Post by **Crispleaf** » Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:55 am

Neoshinobi wrote:People constantly look for White Mage handouts because thats what you are, a support job, your job is to support the team.

My point exactly! I support the team. My team! :!:

When I'm in a party, I certainly don't ask for money for teleports or raises any more than a ninja would ask for money for shihei cast or a ranger would ask money for arrows fired.

In fact, I even kick in a little extra with juices and mushroom soup and echo drops in case I'm silenced. It's because I've joined a team and I'm there to contribute.

However, after hours, when I'm not in a party, how is it that I'm a part of your team all of a sudden? Am I supposed to be the people's white mage

Nobody has that kind of expectation on them, why should a white mage? But white mages often do have that expectation, and I'm not saying I never take pity and help, but I have to draw the line somewhere!

From my fellow white mages, can I get an, "Amen!?"

I've never understood the part where it is assumed I had to be a magic genie to anyone who demanded my services. I am NOT at your beck and call. What I do is out of the kindness of my heart and my own free will. I reserve the right to refuse any and all requests of my time, as would any other character in the game. And I won't be judged on when I offer free help and when I charge for it either. It's my right, I've earned it, and if you don't like it, then please add me to your /blist

...

I'm in an unusually fiery mood today

Where's Sasuske?

Post by **Tivia** » Tue Mar 08, 2005 3:05 am

You guys are making this far more complex then it really is.

Its not the amount of gil, It is the attitude behind it.

Let me give you some background on me, I have played MMORPGs since meridian59, I have played games including Ultima Online, EQ, Shadowbane, DAOC, FFXI, SWG, and a slew of other online multiplayer games I cannot even begin to remember. Over the years I have noticed a disturbing trend that I find myself more and more resentful of. That is the trend of players "Expecting" that other gamers Owe them something. The lack of respect in online gaming communities has gotten appalling. When communities like this first started out, People volunteered to help others out, wether newbies, or just someone in need. The reason this help was so plentiful is people were geniunely grateful and appreciative. However as time has progressed that gratefulness and appreciation has degenerated into expection and in some cases demand. Suddenly new players join a community and the first thing they do is stick their hand out and Demand something...Money..gear..power leveling..Anything to make Their game easier be damned to the fact that it is someone else's game as well.

This is why I have gone from someone who used to host newbie events, give out gear and other things simply for the love of it, to someone who generally either Ignores tells or simply says no. Want to know why I will not consider a tele for less then 1k? and even then its debatable if Ill do it? Simple. when a player messages me asking for a Tele when Im not offering, they are aknowledging that I am not offering and they require a service I can offer. However when they Offer the Minimum that they would offer to someone Offering the service to someone not publically offering. I find that as absolutely insulting and just another reminder of the "You Owe Me" Attitude that seems to prevalent. When I ask for 1k+ I am simply responding to an Insulting attitude with the stance, of "Ok you want me to go out of My way, and waste my game time to Make your gametime easier, I expect you to recognize that I owe you nothing"

Its that simple, its a matter of forcing people to recognize what they are asking. Its simple, I Owe No one anything. Its my game, my character, my time and my money and I will use it in the method that brings me the most enjoyment as that is why I play. I utterly loath the fact I have had to adopt this attitude, however I refuse to continue to be a doormat and perpetuate this mentality that is destroying our online gaming experience. I will not baby sit and teach manners to little johnny or suzy because their parents are too lazy and worthless to teach them respect, I will however openly stand against doing what they have obviously had done to them their entire life, and thats have every whim and demand met. I guess in effect I refuse to raise other peoples kids, regardless of if those kids are 12 or 50, and yes I have met 50 year olds with the mentality of a 12 year old.

I guess Ive gotten into a rant now, but this is just something that irritates me and has grown more irritating over the years. My spouse feels the same, simply sick an tired of people expecting us to cater to them, fine Ill cater to you..but its going to require and extended effort on your part as well. you want my service? pay my price, otherwise I have better things to do. When I want your service I pay your price. People that want to pay the minimum for everything piss me off. I have Never Ever asked for a Teleport, or res in any game that I did not offer at least Double the standard rate. I fully understand they want to play as well. If I am dead somewhere remote, I pay for every bit of that mages time. I have died in remote places many times. Due to what I pay I have yet to have a single mage turn me down to come get me, and I pay well even in crowded areas.

Want to know what I pay when I want someone's service when I realize they are not otherwise offering?

Ill pay 1500 for a teleport without question, and anywhere from 3k to 15k for a res depending on the level of res and how hard I am to get to. Sorry I resent people who expect to have things handed to them for the minimum, that mentaility is the one thing that inceses me more then anything.

Maezen · Post by **Maezen** » Tue Mar 08, 2005 4:35 am

Anem Crisp, Amen.

MithraPride

The things I do for gil.

Teleporting...